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Missing the Asura displacer shot on a Pyro, ouch. Pyros are tanky slowbois with good armor but do not have very good Evasion, so rolling that bad with the big damage AP gun hurts a lot. Particularly a Vet (extra structure, harder to kill in general) with Lightning Reflexes (miss chance from Heavy weapons, which the Displacer ignores because it is a Main mount, not a Heavy mount). Also PTN I believe I'm at 3 heat currently due to an Overcharge on my last turn.
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Jan 21, 2022 00:52
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Now this is a Displacer shot I most definitely didn't want whiffing, but it is what it is. Things getting a little hot too, but manageable.
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Jan 21, 2022 01:21
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I really like the thought the developers put into armor and HP in Lancer. Since armor acts like damage reduction from D&D, mechs (player and enemy alike) with high armor will tend to have reduced HP. This makes armor penetrating weapons terrifying for them, simulating lucky hits from punching straight through the outer armor in ways weapons without penetration can't. I think that's a genuinely clever way to handle things. The Pyro and Goliath are both defenders, but the Pyro's got less than half the Goliath's HP.
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Jan 21, 2022 04:42
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Defender is the weirdest archetype in Lancer, both on the PC and NPC side. It covers a lot of different mechanics and styles of defendering. The Goliath with Crush Targeting directly makes it harder for you to hurt anybody else and is huge so friends can hide behind it and has a very large HP pool with Resistance to attacks from beyond its shotgun range but tends to get shredded quite quickly by short range striker builds. The Pyro is heavily armored, has a strong cone weapon that makes you want to not rush too many people at it, and its shield can give miss chance for allies much like mine does. It is however very slow and has no answer to high damage or AP weapons on fast PCs that can just bypass the shield by flanking it. Except PTN's dice.
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Jan 21, 2022 06:00
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Man I am just completely lost in this rule set. Super appreciate getting introduced to it and seeing it played and such, but the only thing I understand is the fluff. Neither the mechs or their abilities manage to stick around as acquired knowledge, so I don't even know which mechs to root for. If we're still running a vote on Lancer vs regular Battletech, I'd like to vote for going back to Battletech after this campaign is finished. Mostly so I can make heads or tails of what happens again.
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Jan 21, 2022 09:25
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SerthVarnee posted:Man I am just completely lost in this rule set. It's D&D 4th Edition, heavily modified. My biggest issue right now is simply not having time for BattleTech with a coworker out on bereavement due to a direct family member passing away; another out because they caught Covid at the funeral of their directly family member who passed a few days prior to the other coworker's family member dying; and both of these individuals generally being my relief. I've been generally working 12 hour shifts since... 1/2? 1/3? and generally picking up an extra day of shifts on top of that. As much as I love BattleTech, an update generally takes me 3+ hours of work even on a relatively small mission and that's if everyone gets their orders in on time. I don't want to subject the thread to constant delays. This wasn't intentional but Lancer's been a nice reprieve for me since it's significantly less work even when I screw up. We will be going back to BattleTech, don't worry about that. This is an interlude, not a game replacement. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 13:35 on Jan 21, 2022 |
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Jan 21, 2022 13:14
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will we be seeing technical advances in Battletech to allow us to keep using the term 'paracausal'? Because I like it
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Jan 21, 2022 14:43
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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:will we be seeing technical advances in Battletech to allow us to keep using the term 'paracausal'? Because I like it We already have, it's called "anything to do with hyperspace."
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Jan 21, 2022 15:59
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The Black Marauder from the Wag The Dog mission (on a space station getting eaten by hyperspace) should definitely qualify as a paracausal entity.
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Jan 21, 2022 17:10
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My options are so bad this turn. The Bombard can drop a shot into the Pegasus, Black Witch, and Swallowtail that has a 50% of outright killing the Bombard when the Black Witch yeets the artillery shell back at it (playtesting feedback: House Guard is pretty awful to play against); or I can try to paste the only vulnerable player. So here's the part I dislike, per the current Errata quote:When used in response to an attack that targets multiple characters, if it successfully activates, the reaction granted by NOAH’s Diluvian Ark will cause attack rolls made against you and your adjacent allies to automatically miss, but it won’t have any effect on attack rolls made against characters that are within the attack’s area of effect that are not adjacent to you. PTN's note: House Guard extends adjacency by 1 hex, so adjacent becomes a bit of a muddy term This doesn't make sense in a way that genuinely bothers me. Is the initial hit being reflected (a single attack, targeting a hex?) If it is the attacker should only take 4 damage, their single attack failed even if it was a single attack that would have hit multiple targets if it had been successful. A 1:1 trade, efficient for the Black Witch but no worse for the attacker than any other attacker making a single shot. But that's not how it works, it takes damage based on the final number of targets. So without House Guard the Black Witch can 'nope' up to 7 attacks (19 with House Guard!) for the price of negating one single attack, dealing anywhere from 4-76 (but realistic maximum we'll say 16) kinetic damage to the attacker. That's just really loving dumb. If it was 'roll once for each character you choose to protect' that's 1:1 and makes AOE no worse than single target attacks but with a greater chance for things to go instantly wrong for the attacker. That I like! There's risk and reward for the GM and the players that makes 'everyone cluster up around the Black Witch!' less of a no-brainer. Does the Black Witch have enough heat cap to protect all of us? Who spreads out and who stays close? Who does the Black Witch choose not to protect? But as is there's no point in ever fielding a mech with a cone, blast, or line attack if Diluvian Arc is in play unless you're deploying grunt AOE en masse which feels not great. Even without House Guard the trade is so bad it seems genuinely aberrant, with House Guard it's just completely nuts. I'm going to do it just to see what happens. Please pour out a 40 for the Bombard in advance.
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Jan 22, 2022 01:15
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PoptartsNinja posted:My options are so bad this turn. my FVTT group just does individual rolls on AOE's because it's both easier to just hit the button more, and AoE's being all or nothing feels weird and bad without including stuff like ark. I believe it's mainly like that to increase speed of play in physical games; as rolling more slows down the game. As an aside, if the Bombard hits me (Swallowtail) I'd like to Brace. Infidelicious fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Jan 22, 2022 |
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Jan 22, 2022 01:22
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PoptartsNinja posted:My options are so bad this turn. Yeah that was our plan  re NOAH, it absolutely is intended as a gently caress you vs AoE, with the caveat that it restricts positioning to maintain coverage. Since our encounters so far have been mostly killboxes and half our party is long-ranged this hasn't been an issue (and in this particular scene, we started right in spitting range of almost the entire opfor), but NOAH typically doesn't get to have this much scene-long coverage. House Guard is also a factor here, of course - extending adjacency effects is clearly not something the system accounted for, but absent that we'd just be sticking together a bit closer. On the other hand, iirc across 5 Rounds of combat we've had in this Lancer interlude, NOAH has procced 0 times and the BW has gotten to attack once, so keeping it up has been taxing for no appreciable payoff so far.
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Jan 22, 2022 01:46
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Infidelicious posted:I believe it's mainly like that to increase speed of play in physical games; as rolling more slows down the game. I appreciate that. Conspiratiorist posted:re NOAH, it absolutely is intended as a gently caress you vs AoE, with the caveat that it restricts positioning to maintain coverage. That I don't appreciate or respect anywhere near as much, because it forces the GM to either bring so much AOE that nothing can cope with it to overwhelm and hard-counter a single tool, or to just give AOE weapons a pass entirely. There really doesn't seem like a middle ground. This is one of the few interactions in Lancer I genuinely don't like. If I were to houserule it, I'd give the Black Witch the option to either: take one roll, get one reflect but you negate the impact even to targets outside of the Arc's protection (because you're blocking the initial shell / reflecting the shot as early as possible / etc); or you let the attack go off and roll multiple times for the chance of multiple reflects. There are times when the party might be willing to take that risk if everyone's healthy and it gives them a chance to say, first-turn eliminate a bombard that's out of their range. Or to trade everyone getting damaged for a higher chance that not everyone will be damaged if the Ark fails. Basically, I'd give the players the choice to do as much or as little rolling as they feel comfortable with without completely negating a quarter of the NPCs. Conspiratiorist posted:On the other hand, iirc across 5 Rounds of combat we've had in this Lancer interlude, NOAH has procced 0 times and the BW has gotten to attack once, so keeping it up has been taxing for no appreciable payoff so far. It's actively discouraged me from doing anything that interacts with the Black Witch if I can help it. I'm not saying this as a complaint, it's an extremely good defensive tool that makes me put serious thought into my turns; but at the same time it still means the Pyro's best choice was to run away from the largest cluster of enemies to chance the only thing it had a chance of damaging. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 02:13 on Jan 22, 2022 |
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Jan 22, 2022 02:06
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quote:This doesn't make sense in a way that genuinely bothers me. Is the initial hit being reflected (a single attack, targeting a hex?) If it is the attacker should only take 4 damage, their single attack failed even if it was a single attack that would have hit multiple targets if it had been successful. A 1:1 trade, efficient for the Black Witch but no worse for the attacker than any other attacker making a single shot. But that's not how it works, it takes damage based on the final number of targets. It's one system activating when the Bombard fires, but the system slams off one interceptor per cluster submunition that then homes back in to the shooter But yeah a Bombard (a big aoe shooter with no armor and built in inaccuracy on its big damage aoe gun) is my best case scenario for this system and this build and even using it optimally, we're still risking a huge smackdown on the entire player group because of the Bombard's Cluster Munitions trait that adds damage per target in the blast radius. The Pyro, as an alternate example, would barely care about this since it has such high armor that it can shrug off the retaliation damage. NOAH vs Bombard is simply a high risk/high reward interaction, one of the highest in the game. Here's hoping I don't lose a fourth (I think?) coin flip in a row.
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Jan 22, 2022 02:09
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You may also be wondering, hey, how does a thing that shoots interceptors at projectiles work against a flamethrower? And the answer is: paracausal technology.
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Jan 22, 2022 02:27
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Lancer Interlude: Round 2 – Turn 2 I’m not sure how to describe what happened this turn, which is the real reason I’m grousing. Movement Map  Combat Pegasus (Player) - [Free Action] Ushabti Ushabti’s the Pyro for 1 damage! - [Free Action] Ushabti Ushabti’s the Pyro for 1 damage! - [Free Action] Ushabti Ushabti’s the Pyro for 1 damage! Structure Damage sustained! - [Free Action] Steady Your Aim, becoming immobile! Pyro - Rolls 1d6: 6, suffers a glancing blow! Pyro is impaired until the end of its next turn! Pegasus (Player) - [Quick Tech] Locks On to Pyro - [Skirmish] Smartgun (consuming Lock On, consuming 1 accuracy to Zero In) and Oracle LMG-I vs. Pyro - - Smartgun ignores cover, rolls (4 + 10 + 3 = 17) hit for (4 - 3 armor = 1 / 2 resistance = 1) kinetic damage! - - Firebreak Shield has a 4+ chance to block Oracle LMG-I: rolled 6, succeeds! Swallowtail (Player) - [Reaction] Trigger: another character consumes Lock On, Autopod attacks Pyro - - Autopod hits Pyro for (3 + 3 Overpower Caliber - 3 armor = 3 / 2 resistance = 2) kinetic damage! PTN’s note: Infidelicious didn’t send an order for this reaction, so if you changed your mind and didn’t want to fire the autopod here please let me know! Pegasus (Player) - [Free Action] Autogun vs Pyro - - Firebreak Shield has a 4+ chance to block Autogun: rolled 5, succeeds! Bombard - [Barrage] Fires Bombard Cannon w/ Earthshaker Shells at hex 0628! Pegasus (Player) - [Reaction] Braces Swallowtail (Player) - [Reaction] Braces Black Witch (Player) - - [Diluvian Ark] negates every attack on a 4+: rolls 5! Black Witch gains 2 heat! - - Attack against the Black Witch automatically misses: Bombard takes 4 kinetic damage! - - Attack against the Pegasus automatically misses: Bombard takes 4 kinetic damage! - - Attack against the Swallowtail automatically misses: Bombard takes 4 kinetic damage! Bombard destroyed! Bombard PTN’s note: Here’s the aberrant part of this interaction! - Earthshaker Shell hit hex 0628: all characters within Burst 3 must pass a hull save or be knocked prone - - [Black Witch] rolls (4 + 9 = 13): succeeds! - - [Swallowtail] rolls (2 + 10 = 12): fails! - - [Pegasus] rolls (3 + 20 = 23): succeeds! - Earthshaker Shell creates Hard Cover in hex 0625, 0726! Active Map  Primary Objective 1 - Open the Exterior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 0923 (0/1) - - Deal 40 damage to exterior door (0/40) - - Bait the Bombard into damaging the door twice (0/2) Primary Objective 2 - Open the Interior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 2404 (0/1) - - Deal 40 damage to interior door (0/40) Alternative Objective - Defeat Most Enemies (0/?) Waiting Players   Activated Players   Waiting NPCs Activated NPC(s)  Special Rules - Any attack launched by the Bombard that would strike the Exterior Door is delayed in striking by 1 turn (not round). Orders Due Wednesday - Turn 1 Thursday - Turn 2 Friday - Turn 3 Saturday - Turn 4 PTN’s note: With no enemies left, the remaining two players can both send orders. Just let me know which of you is acting first! PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 02:34 on Jan 22, 2022 |
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Jan 22, 2022 02:31
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Alright, so the Earthshaker Shell is a rider effect to the Bombard Cannon, centered on the target. Even though the Bombard attacks missed (because of NOAH), everyone still has to make the relevant saves, and cover is still created. Basically, NOAH protected them from the worst part of the attack and redirected that kinetic energy back to the offending Bombard, but they felt it, and the terrain around them popped up. Important clarification: Brace is a Reaction taken in response to being Hit by an attack. Since the Bombard Cannon missed, neither the Pegasus nor Swallowtail needed to brace (indeed, they couldn't).
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Jan 22, 2022 02:43
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PoptartsNinja posted:I’m not sure how to describe what happened this turn, which is the real reason I’m grousing. i got you fam quote:Recorded and Entered by: Hon. Michael Anderson, Archivist 1st Class,
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Jan 22, 2022 02:46
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The Oldest Man posted:i got you fam Fair, and the best argument so far.
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Jan 22, 2022 03:19
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Paracausaility means never having to explain how it works.
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Jan 22, 2022 08:08
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wiegieman posted:Paracausaility means never having to explain how it works. haha paracausality machine go brrrr
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Jan 22, 2022 19:51
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Jeez I really don't appreciate how precious everything in Lancer is.
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Jan 22, 2022 20:22
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It's that Chief O'Brien "I hate temporal mechanics" scene but with paracausality instead
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Jan 23, 2022 17:32
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Some rules interactions questions are delaying this turn, sorry everyone!
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Jan 23, 2022 22:22
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Lancer Interlude: Round 2 – Turn 3 Triada rushed in, while Nana still held the Pyro’s attention. Duel or not, the gauntlet hadn’t been thrown, exactly. That meant the enemy mech was still fair game for a combat challenge—another kill in an honorable duel meant another mark of honor she could leverage in her future attempts to return to her House. It hardly mattered if the enemy mech was already half dead, so long as the challenge had yet to be made she could claim it for herself. The intense heat from the Pyro’s open reactor vents sent up warning claxons as they pushed Thou Shalt Not into the danger zone: the risky area where her engine was in danger of shutting itself down—but even that wasn’t enough to deter her as she dove in close enough to make sure her Impact Lance would be a sure hit. The Pyro buckled as her lance cored completely through and burned a perfectly conical hole in the rough cliff behind it. Movement Map  Combat Black Witch (Player) - [Moves] to 0724! Gains 3 heat from Pyro’s [Unshielded Reactor]! Black Witch enters the Danger Zone! - [Skirmish] Pyro with Impact Lance and Thermal Pistol - - Rolls (4 + 4 + 2 = 10) vs Eva and hit for (4 + 5 Overpower Caliber + 5 Fusion Hemorrhage = 14) energy damage, and gains 2 heat from Overkill rerolls. Pyro destroyed! - [Quick Action] Deploys Diluvian Ark! Active Map  Primary Objective 1 - Open the Exterior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 0923 (0/1) - - Deal 40 damage to exterior door (0/40) - - Bait the Bombard into damaging the door twice (0/2) Primary Objective 2 - Open the Interior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 2404 (0/1) - - Deal 40 damage to interior door (0/40) Alternative Objective - Defeat Most Enemies (0/?) Waiting Players  Activated Players  Waiting NPCs Activated NPC(s)  Special Rules - Any attack launched by the Bombard that would strike the Exterior Door is delayed in striking by 1 turn (not round). Orders Due Wednesday - Turn 1 Thursday - Turn 2 Friday - Turn 3 Saturday - Turn 4
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Jan 24, 2022 00:45
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That's boosted paracausal damage baybee So a couple notes on what just happened there. One of the Black Witch's traits is having a high base capacity to mount systems. The NOAH-class nhp is deep into another license, and it shares a license slot with another piece of equipment (Paracausal mod) that doesn't get a lot of play because it's very expensive (4 SP, tied for the most expensive system in the core book) and typically only worth it on strikers that don't have the SP budget to mount it and don't have much reason to dig that far into a Defender license to begin with to get access to it. Duelist defender Black Witch is a chance for it to shine and the Paracausal Mod is one of the build's party tricks. It does two things: -Gives the weapon the Overkill tag that causes 1s on damage dice to be rerolled at the cost of heat -Causes the weapon's damage to ignore all resistances and armor Against a Pyro, which has very high armor and strong Resistance but lower than average base HP, a high damage weapon that ignores all those things gets the job done. However now I'm on 8 heat which is a little toastier than I'd like and heat management on this build is delicate since I don't have totally reliable tools to increase it back into the danger zone if I just stabilize to go to zero.
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Jan 26, 2022 08:10
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Lancer Interlude: Round 2 – Turn 4 “Take over, OSIRIS,” Frank ordered as he slipped out of his restraint straps and pulled the heavy coat he’d borrowed from a local over his stealth suit. The latter was an excellent tool for staying hidden, but not so much for staying warm. He was glad for his foresight the moment he slipped out of the cockpit. Even in the lee of the mountains the wind still cut straight through him like a knife. “Thank god none of us had to bail on the glacial plains,” he muttered, his breath turning to frost that instantly clung to the nearest surface—mainly his face. He shut his mouth to keep the worst of the searing cold out of his lungs, and was imminently grateful for the tertiary robotic arm he’d had grafted to his nervous system. It, at least, didn’t feel the cold—which meant he should be able to work the door controls without taking his hands out of the coat’s pockets. Movement Map  Combat Swallowtail (Player) - [Moves] to stand up! - [Boost] to 0725! - [Quick Action] deploys Hive Drone to 1325! - [Free Action] Give control to Osiris-class NHP Frank Columbo Detective - [Full Action] Dismount Swallowtail into hex 0824! Active Map  Primary Objective 1 - Open the Exterior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 0923 (0/1) - - Deal 40 damage to exterior door (0/40) - - Bait the Bombard into damaging the door twice (0/2) Primary Objective 2 - Open the Interior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 2404 (0/1) - - Deal 40 damage to interior door (0/40) Alternative Objective - Defeat Most Enemies (7/?) Waiting Players Activated Players Waiting NPCs Activated NPC(s) Special Rules - Any attack launched by the Bombard that would strike the Exterior Door is delayed in striking by 1 turn (not round). Orders Due Wednesday - Turn 1 (We’re off schedule but it’s fine, it’s my fault. I just can’t get anything done on days I work split shifts.) Thursday - Turn 2 Friday - Turn 3 Saturday - Turn 4
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Jan 26, 2022 22:45
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I haven't gotten any orders this week. Is everything alright?
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Jan 28, 2022 21:52
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I thought we were due next weds due to being off schedule... Are you expecting orders from someone today?
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Jan 28, 2022 21:54
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Sure, we can skip the week. Gives me a little more time to make sure the opforce isn't going to fold instantly.
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Jan 28, 2022 23:29
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I haven't gotten orders yet, please get them to me ASAP!
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Feb 2, 2022 20:20
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Sent.
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Feb 2, 2022 20:59
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Lancer Interlude: Round 3 – Turn 1 Osiris dutifully followed behind as Frank clambered over the powdery snow dune and slid down the far side. He knew if it followed standard colonial patterns, the door controls would always be on the left—and he was rewarded as he slid bodily into the computer terminal. Using both arms and legs to steady himself, his tertiary arm typed away at the console. The pirates had managed to get in, so he doubted the encryption was anything extraordinary. A moment later the door simply opened—whoever had built this place had either left in a hurry or died inside. The exterior door hadn’t even been locked. A claxon sounded and a rush of hot, humid air flooded out of the entryway where the frigid air instantly turned it into a hail of icy razors that stung Frank’s exposed skin. Osiris swiveled, pointing the Swallowtail’s weapons downrange, but didn’t fire. Either there were no obvious threats or the pirates were lurking behind solid cover. “Dark in there,” Charlotte’s voice carried through Frank’s earbud. “Looks like they’ve switched off everything except the emergency lights. Getting definite mass readings, though—and something strange. Might be a tiny mech or a squad of troopers. Or maybe a drone?” Movement Map  Combat Frank Columbo - Moves to 0923 - [Full Action] Opens Exterior Door! - [Full Action] Dismount Swallowtail into hex 0824! Swallowtail (Player) - [Moves] to 1023! - [Free Action] Becomes invisible! Spite TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN - [Moves] to 2112! - [Quick Action] Boosts to 1913! - [Quick Tech] Enthrones in hex 1913! Spite becomes immobilized! Active Map  Primary Objective 1 - Open the Exterior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 0923 (Complete!) Primary Objective 2 - Open the Interior Blast Door - - Exit your mech and hack the door using the computer in 2404 (0/1) - - Deal 40 damage to interior door (0/40) Alternative Objective - Defeat Most Enemies (7/12?) Waiting Players Activated Players  Waiting NPCs      Activated NPC(s) Orders Due Wednesday - Turn 1 Thursday - Turn 2 Friday - Turn 3 Saturday - Turn 4 PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Feb 3, 2022 |
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Feb 2, 2022 23:54
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Oh that's mean.
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Feb 3, 2022 00:02
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Conspiratiorist posted:Oh that's mean. The Avenger Ultra, or the Spite?
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Feb 3, 2022 00:05
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Both together ED: Having a little trouble parsing the interior - I'm to assume the green outline means there's a general zone of soft cover throughout?
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Feb 3, 2022 00:07
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Yeah, it's dark / foggy in there so everything not near an emergency light has soft cover. Edit: That may change over time. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 00:33 on Feb 3, 2022 |
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Feb 3, 2022 00:15
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How high is the ceiling? Asking for a friend. Also the Active Map has the enemy Movement overlain.
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Feb 3, 2022 00:37
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Big enough for a Goliath so we'll say height 3 Edit: Anyone want to do a rough assessment of the OpForce for our viewers? I feel like the OpForce is particularly mean but not explicitly targeted at anyone in particular. This was almost a Spite + Witch power couple that I decided to downgrade to a Scout at the last minute 
PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 02:00 on Feb 3, 2022 |
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Feb 3, 2022 00:39
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"Tu sais ce que tu as fait" is somewhat grammatically incorrect. It would be "Tu sais qu'est-ce que t'as fait". I think. My french is a little rusty. And while the bombard didn't have the name I expected I'm glad it got some use.
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Feb 3, 2022 02:41
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