why to be vegetarian ?

I'm 17 and vegetarian 4 years ago. But i'm not sure not eat meat is realy
useful.

The humans need feed meat : all the doctors say that : You can eat only
fish. But if you don't eat fish and other meat, you'll be sick.

The reason to be vegetarian it's that we want not kill animals. So why don't
eat beef, and only eat fish ? it's nonsensical !

Did you understand my english ? What do you think about it ?

Pierrot

Not all doctors say that humans need to eat meat in order to be
healthy. There are some doctors who say that eating meat will actually
make you sick, and that you should only eat plant-based foods. Also,
most vegetarians do not eat fish. Many people would say that somebody
who eats fish is not a vegetarian.

What the doctors in which you referred to are saying about eating meat
may very well be true. There is plenty of evidence which proves that a
diet lacking meat may prevent your body from functioning at it's peak
ability, and may cause more serious problems. There is also evidence
that a diet high in complex carbohydrates (which most vegetarians and
vegans eat) can be very unhealthy.

Good luck Pierrot.

Please cite your evidence on COMPLEX carbs. Research does show a wider
range of deleterious effects from diets high in SIMPLE carbs (sugars),
which is not limited to veg-n diets.

I once read about some man who ate only one herb, and nothing else, and
lived for many years.
There are also said to be some Tibetan yogis who do not eat at all, but
live by deep breathing and the absorption of sunlight.
If these cases are true reports, then the body must have the ability to
maintain itself indefinitely without food, although one would think it would
have to have all the nutrients it needs to begin with. The metabolic cycle
would then seem to be a closed system, needing only occasional nutrients,
and based on energy rather than matter.
So not only does one not have to be a meat-eater, one does not have to be
a vegetarian. People to not have to raise animals for meat, nor to grow
crops. Perhaps all a person would need would be an occasional vitamin, or
perhaps a daily dose of manna. On the other hand, this might not work in an
enviornment where the air is polluted, or the sunlight is weak.
However, it might take some time to give up food. But maybe the best way
is to go "cold turkey." Perhaps eating is an addiction.
I don't think I will skip lunch today, though.

· Vegans contribute to the deaths of animals by their use
of wood and paper products, and roads and all types of
buildings, and by their own diet just as everyone else does.
What vegans try to avoid are products which provide life
(and death) for farm animals, but even then they would have
to avoid the following in order to be successful:
_________________________________________________________
Tires, Surgical sutures, Matches, Soaps, Photographic film,
Cosmetics, Shaving cream, Paints, Candles, Crayon/Chalk,
Toothpaste, Deodorants, Mouthwash, Paper, Upholstery, Paints,
Floor waxes, Glass, Water Filters, Rubber, Fertilizer,
Antifreeze

http://www.aif.org/lvstock.htm
ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
_________________________________________________________
Ceramics, Insecticides, Insulation, Linoleum, Plastic,
Textiles, Blood factors, Collagen, Heparin, Insulin,
Pancreatin, Thrombin, Vasopressin, Vitamin B-12, Asphalt,
auto and jet lubricants, outboard engine oil, high-performance
greases, brake fluid

http://www.teachfree.com/student/wow_that_cow.htm
ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
_________________________________________________________
contact-lens care products, glues for paper and cardboard
cartons, bookbinding glue, clarification of wines, Hemostats,
sunscreens and sunblocks, dental floss, hairspray, inks, PVC

http://www.discover.com/aug_01/featcow.html
ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
_________________________________________________________
Explosives, Solvents, Industrial Oils, Industrial Lubricants,
Stearic Acid, Biodegradable Detergents, Herbicides, Syringes,
Gelatin Capsules, Bandage Strips, Combs and Toothbrushes,
Emery Boards and Cloth, Adhesive Tape, Laminated Wood Products,
Plywood and Paneling, Wallpaper and Wallpaper Paste, Cellophane
Wrap and Tape, Adhesive Tape, Abrasives, Bone Charcoal for High
Grade Steel, Steel Ball Bearings

http://www.sheepusa.org/environment/products.shtml
ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
The meat industry provides life for the animals that it
slaughters, and the animals live and die in it as they do
in any other habitat. They also depend on it for their
lives like the animals in any other habitat. If people
consume animal products from animals they think are
raised in decent ways, they will be promoting life for
more such animals in the future.
From the life and death of a thousand pound grass raised
steer and whatever he happens to kill during his life, people
get over 500 pounds of human consumable meat. From a grass
raised dairy cow people get thousands of dairy servings. Due to
the influence of farm machinery, and *icides, and in the case
of rice the flooding and draining of fields, one serving of soy
or rice based product is likely to involve more animal deaths
than hundreds of servings derived from grass raised cattle.
Grass raised cattle products contribute to less wildlife deaths,
better wildlife habitat, and better lives for cattle. ·

David,
Do you really and honestly believe the above?

Relevant news story;

NASA To Study Man Who
Lives On Liquids And Light
Sydney Morning Herald
6-30-3

An Indian man, who claims to have survived only on liquids and
sunlight for eight years, has been invited by NASA to show them
how he does it.

Hira Ratan Manek - also known as Hirachand - a 64-year-old
mechanical engineer who lives in the southern state of Kerala,
apparently started disliking food in 1992, the Hindustan Times
newspaper reported.

In 1995, he went on a pilgrimage to the Himalayas and stopped
eating completely on his return.

His wife, Vimla, said: "Every evening he looks at the sun for one
hour without batting an eyelid. It is his main food. Occasionally he
takes coffee, tea or some other liquid."

Last June, scientists from the US space agency verified that Manek
spent 130 days surviving only on water, the report said.
They even named this subsistence on water and solar energy after
him: The HRM (Hira Ratan Manek) Phenomenon.

Mr Manek is now in the US to show NASA's scientists how he
survives without food.

The US space agency hopes to use the technique to solve food
storage and preservation problems on its expeditions, the report said.

Mr Manek said he "eats through his eyes" in the evening, when the
sun's ultraviolet rays are least harmful. He and his wife claim the
technique is totally scientific. However, doctors warn that staring at
the sun can make you blind.

His wife said: "He has a special taste for sun energy. He believes
only 5 per cent of human brain cells are used by most people. The
other 95 per cent can be activated through solar energy."

DPA

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/06/29/1056825280652.html

Dude looks like a zombie. Here's a DIY site:
http://www.newknowledge.org/fromweb/manekji.html

Let us know how much your stomach growls after your first day without
food and how well you can see after sun-gazing for an hour a day for
your first full month. BTW, I'm not sure if those strange sideburns are
a side-effect of sun-gazing but you can probably break out your razor if
they appear (I picture you with hairy armpits and legs).

This dude is impressive. Thanks for the link.

About the only thing that impresses me about him is the money he says he
saves on toilet paper. The last sentence on that page speaks for itself:
"For this to work, I must BELIEVE that it will!!" It's prattle.

There are some pretty serious drawbacks to sun-gazing -- even at dusk
and dawn as that site advises. Macular degeneration and cataracts are
quite common and can lead to glaucoma (which, in turn, leads to
blindness). It ain't worth it.

http://www.glaucoma.org/learn/
http://www.davidsoneye.com/faq-amd.htm
http://digitalfire.com/education/toxicity/radiation.html
http://tinyurl.com/fuv4

>> ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

>> ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

>> ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

>> ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

Of course I do, since it's true. Why wouldn't I believe it?

Various sources. It's just common sense anyway, though
not everyone thinks about it directly, and some people go
to considerable effort to *prevent* other people from thinking
about it directly. That brings up the question: Why do they
do that? One thing is for certain: it's **not** because they
are considerate of human influence on the lives of animals.

The practice appears to have a spiritual element to it, so it follows
that mind and feelings would need to be in sync' with the exercise.

Your links don't show that damage can occur during those times.

We'll see that many things aren't 'worth it'..

> http://www.glaucoma.org/learn/

- "Glaucoma can occur as the result of ...... diabetes. "

Am J Public Health 1985 May;75(5):507-12
Does a vegetarian diet reduce the occurrence of diabetes?
Snowdon DA, Phillips RL.
We propose the hypothesis that a vegetarian diet reduces
the risk of developing diabetes. Findings that have generated
this hypothesis are from a population of 25,698 adult White
Seventh-day Adventists identified in 1960. During 21 years
of follow-up, the risk of diabetes as an underlying cause of
death in Adventists was approximately one-half the risk for all
US Whites. Within the male Adventist population, vegetarians
had a substantially lower risk than non-vegetarians of diabetes
as an underlying or contributing cause of death. Within both
the male and female Adventist populations, the prevalence of
self-reported diabetes also was lower in vegetarians than in
non-vegetarians. The associations observed between diabetes
and meat consumption were apparently not due to confounding
by over- or under-weight, other selected dietary factors, or
physical activity. All of the associations between meat
consumption and diabetes were stronger in males than in
females. PMID: 3985239 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE

Being omnivorous just aint worth it.

- "It can also be caused by certain drugs such as steroids."

Not worth it. (Eating a wholesome frugivorous diet, we're
very unlikely to ever have a need to take anti-inflammatories).

> http://www.davidsoneye.com/faq-amd.htm

- "Hypertension: The link between high blood pressure and AMD
is well established. Remember, there are often no symptoms of
high blood pressure. A regular check up is the best way to have
a clear handle on any medical problems that you may have."

Am J Clin Nutr 1999 Sep;70(3 Suppl):532S-538S
Associations between diet and cancer, ischemic heart disease,
and all-cause mortality in non-Hispanic white California
Seventh-day Adventists.
Fraser GE. Center for Health Research and the Department of
Epidemiology and Biostatistics, Loma Linda University, CA USA.

Results associating diet with chronic disease in a cohort of 34192
California Seventh-day Adventists are summarized. Most Seventh-day
Adventists do not smoke cigarettes or drink alcohol, and there is a wide
range of dietary exposures within the population. About 50% of those
studied ate meat products <1 time/wk or not at all, and vegetarians
consumed more tomatoes, legumes, nuts, and fruit, but less coffee,
doughnuts, and eggs than did nonvegetarians. Multivariate analyses
showed significant associations between beef consumption and fatal
ischemic heart disease (IHD) in men [relative risk (RR) = 2.31 for
subjects who ate beef > or =3 times/wk compared with vegetarians],
significant protective associations between nut consumption and fatal
and nonfatal IHD in both sexes (RR approximately 0.5 for subjects
who ate nuts > or =5 times/wk compared with those who ate nuts
<1 time/wk), and reduced risk of IHD in subjects preferring whole-grain
to white bread. The lifetime risk of IHD was reduced by approximately
31% in those who consumed nuts frequently and by 37% in male
vegetarians compared with nonvegetarians. Cancers of the colon and
prostate were significantly more likely in nonvegetarians (RR of 1.88
and 1.54, respectively), and frequent beef consumers also had higher
risk of bladder cancer. Intake of legumes was negatively associated
with risk of colon cancer in nonvegetarians and risk of pancreatic
cancer. Higher consumption of all fruit or dried fruit was associated
with lower risks of lung, prostate, and pancreatic cancers.
Cross-sectional data suggest vegetarian Seventh-day Adventists have
lower risks of diabetes mellitus, hypertension, and arthritis than
nonvegetarians. Thus, among Seventh-day Adventists, vegetarians are
healthier than nonvegetarians but this cannot be ascribed only to the
absence of meat.

PMID: 10479227

Being omnivorous- it really isn't worth it.

- "deliberate sungazing which can permanently damage the macula"

Well, yes.. that is of course true, but, possibly not "in the first one
hour after sunrise or the last one hour just before sunset. During
this time, the sun rays are not too strong, and also the UV radiation
etc is supposed to be lower, so no harm will come to the eyes."
This man claims to have been doing this for years without being
harmed. (If he were, it would have been discovered by NASA).

> http://digitalfire.com/education/toxicity/radiation.html

- "Ultraviolet radiation of wave lengths shorter than 300 nm.
(actinic rays) can damage the corneal epithelium. This is most
commonly the result of exposure to the sun at high altitude and
in areas where shorter wave lengths are readily reflected from
bright surfaces such as snow, water, and sand."

> http://tinyurl.com/fuv4

- "Intense exposure to ultraviolet rays, such as that which may
occur when sunlight reflects off water or sand, can inflame the
white part of the eye (conjunctiva)."

Mountaineering, flying at high altitude, skiing, sailing, and going
to the beach - just not worth it (without protective eye-gear).

Optimal Nutrition and Atrophic Macular Degeneration
5.Minimise red meat, eggs, and dairy foods, in fact a vegan
diet is often very good.
http://www.cleareyeclinic.com/eyediet.html.

pearl wrote:

The story appears to be completely fabricated:

http://web.mid-day.com/news/world/2003/july/57637.htm

We have no record of Manek: NASA

San Francisco: After a thorough check with all its scientific officers and
regional offices
throughout the US over two days, a NASA spokesperson has denied it had
invited Hira
Ratan Manek in any official capacity, or that it has anything to do with him.

Recent news reports had stated that Manek, a 64-year-old mechanical engineer,
who claims
he has not eaten in eight years and lives on water and solar energy, had been
invited by
NASA to New York to show them how it was done.

The report stated that he had left for NASA on June 27.

However, NASA spokesperson Dolores Beasley said she had no idea why press
reports
had claimed that NASA had invited Manek. “No one checked with us,” said
Dolores,
public affairs officer for biological and physical research.

“We have no record of him being involved with us. We have checked with all
offices doing
related research at centers such as Johnson, Marshall and Ames.”

Thanks for that vze2ztqw. After all, it is the Truth that counts.

This is the beauty of an open forum like this.. 'the truth is out there'. :)
(.. and the more masochistic amongst us get the added pleasure
of getting to to eat humble-pie in full public view. . watta rush. l ;)

==============================================

Anyway, I'm aware of ascetics' sometimes extended fasting,
was prompted to do a quick search, and quickly found this;

'.. The mountain yogi, undisturbed by the hectic pace of the city,
living in the pure air and sun with few distractions to stir the passions
and emotions, usually eats a pure and light diet of simple vegetables
and fruit, and eventually consuming only tonic herbs. The older
Taoist classics advocate the elimination of grains, meats, garlic and
onions for the yogi. Grains were considered to feed "The Three
Worms" which reside in the Three Dan Tians and gradually devour
one's life force. The energy in grains is heavy, and one doing
extensive meditation would naturally incline to give them up.
Meat was avoided; the beneficial spirits residing in the adepts body
"have a horror of blood, the Breath of which wounds them, causes
them to flee, and thus shortens life."4 Onions and garlic turn the
outer breath foul, and are considered to have a similar polluting
effect on the inner Qi.

Total fasting is generally avoided, as it tends to weaken and
slow down one's digestive system, like letting the fire go out. One
exception, however, is for the Taoist adept preparing for a long
out-of-body journey. Here the yogi must become a true breatharian
for weeks or months before leaving the body. Otherwise food left
in the intestines would putrify or harden, causing serious problems
upon the adept's return to the body.5 Another advantage of
becoming a breatharian is the ability to remain in meditation retreat
in the mountains for lengthy periods of time without needing supplies. '

FOUNDATIONS OF TAOIST PRACTICE
by Jampa Mackenzie Stewart
http://www.healingtaoinstitute.com/articles/Foundations%20of%20Taoist%
[Jampa Mackenzie Stewart holds a Master's degree in Oriental Medicine.
He has been a student and practitioner of Taoist and Buddhist arts since
the age of sixteen. In 1981, Jampa traveled to China with the first U.S.
delegation to study the original Chen style of T'ai Chi with several of the
world's top masters. He has been a student of Taoist Master Mantak
Chia since 1982, and is a Senior Instructor of The Healing Tao System.
Jampa has written over thirty published articles on Taoist and Buddhist
practice, and his book, The Life of Gampopa: The Incomparable Dharma
Lord of Tibet, will be published this fall by Snow Lion Publications. He is
a senior editor and contributing writer for Healing Tao books, and
collaborated with Chia on Awaken Healing Light of the Tao. ' ]

Just thought that may be of interest to someone else here. Good article.

Lotus.

Hehehe... you don't say.

<snip>

Yes, so why do you still believe in the beings under Mount Shasta, foot
massage, crystals, polar holes, crop circles, chemtrails, etc.?

Actually, truth is close at hand. YOUR VIEWS are "out there."

You still haven't told us your age or how the cc of your moped.

Truth is offered so you have to run and find more esoteric bullshit.
Typical, nutty OLD Lotus.

No, it's not a good article. It's bullshit.

Yes, it is a good article. You didn't read it, you bullshitter.