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MAbtc
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August 08, 2017, 08:20:49 PM |
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Very interesting development. A .cc domain... the top-level domain for Cocos (Keeling) Islands, an Australian territory. I'm not sure if that's a good idea or not. I was hoping to see a domain from a country that is known for its unfriendliness to the U.S. I don't put the prospects of a relaunch or repayment very high, but maybe this inches up the odds a bit. If they come back after all this, BTC-e will be truly legendary. |
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Error 522
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August 08, 2017, 09:45:04 PM |
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Refunding fiat with an increase to allow for btc price rise is a flawed idea. It assumes that the fiat holder would have traded perfectly and held.
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squatter
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Activity: 1666
Merit: 1196
STOP SNITCHIN'
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August 08, 2017, 10:46:52 PM |
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In the Star Wars analogy, I agree. If only it were so simple! The fact of the matter is, by targeting the owners with criminal charges, the US authorities have made it much more likely that the owners will disappear with no attempt at relaunching or refunding customers. Any effort they make to repay customers puts them at greater risk. That makes our odds pretty bad.  Perhaps the US intention is to frighten people away from using crypto. Of course it could be just corruption. eg. when the two DEA agents stole coins from the Silk Road seizure. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2016/08/stealing-bitcoins-with-badges-how-silk-roads-dirty-cops-got-caught/Maybe some other US agents are looking to try the same caper. The intention could be to frighten people away from crypto, but it seems more so directed at commerce and value transfer that the US government cannot control. I don't see this sort of seizure happening to Coinbase, Gemini or Itbit. Those companies have poured incredible amounts of resources into legal compliance and obtaining the proper licenses. At most, they'd probably get small fines from regulatory agencies if anything was out of order. just ignore the statist fuck and move on
Done and done. That guy is a broken record at this point. |
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figmentofmyass
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August 08, 2017, 11:09:09 PM |
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Domain most likely not under btce control. Domain Name: BTC-E.CC Registry Domain ID: 130469693_DOMAIN_CC-VRSN Registrar WHOIS Server: whois.namecheap.com Registrar URL: http://www.namecheap.com Updated Date: 2017-07-03T07:19:31Z Creation Date: 2017-07-03T07:10:38Z i'd agree that this is likely not the real btc-e admins. i would assume that a number of fake phishing sites are being set up right now, just on the chance that btc-e relaunches in some capacity and tries to refund users. statistically, that's what this probably is. but im curious: what makes you say that it is "most likely not under btc-e control?" |
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JoeMue
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August 09, 2017, 12:02:41 AM |
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I had some hope before (see my last post), but it is gone. I've been using BTC-e since early 2013 and moved a lot of coins back and forth. After some coin tracing, I am sure that these were the cold wallets of BTC-e: https://blockchain.info/address/16ZbpCEyVVdqu8VycWR8thUL2Rd9JnjzHthttps://blockchain.info/address/18f1yugoAJuXcHAbsuRVLQC9TezJ6iVRLpMost of my coins I moved to BTC-e ended up in these wallets. It seemed reasonable that they moved the coins to a different wallet, because the FBI might find the privat key in some seized equipment. But why would they split these wallet into thousands of new wallets? They created more than 20000 new wallets within a few days. Is that some kind of coin mixing? Why all that effort? Aren't they busy setting up a new website? These thousands of new wallets make it much more complicated to refund the users. I am sorry, but there is just one storyline left: Cold wallet address of BTC-e was probably well known to the sharks. Owners of BTC-e were afraid that miners could block that specific address forever if they just run with the coins. And they would have had a hard time cashing out in any exchange. So they set up the story of refunding everyone, which gave them the time to mix the coins, making it impossible for miners and exchanges to block all of the new addresses. It's done now and all what's left is silence. Please tell me I am wrong! But I can't imagine any other story at the moment... |
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illinest
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August 09, 2017, 12:11:03 AM |
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It seemed reasonable that they moved the coins to a different wallet, because the FBI might find the privat key in some seized equipment.
But why would they split these wallet into thousands of new wallets? They created more than 20000 new wallets within a few days. Is
that some kind of coin mixing? Why all that effort? Aren't they busy setting up a new website? These thousands of new wallets make it
much more complicated to refund the users. When the the FBI seized the Silk Road wallet, didn't they move all the coins at once to a new address? That's not what happened here. I don't think spreading inputs to many addresses makes it much more complicated to refund users, but I'm also not sure why they would be split this way, either. It reminds me of the Bitfinex hacker, actually. I am sorry, but there is just one storyline left:
Cold wallet address of BTC-e was probably well known to the sharks. Owners of BTC-e were afraid that miners could block that specific address forever if they just
run with the coins. And they would have had a hard time cashing out in any exchange. So they set up the story of refunding everyone,
which gave them the time to mix the coins, making it impossible for miners and exchanges to block all of the new addresses. It's done now and
all what's left is silence.
Please tell me I am wrong! But I can't imagine any other story at the moment...
Your story doesn't make much sense. Miners are unlikely to collude as such, and even if they tried, a minority of miners would eventually publish the transactions. Your story also doesn't address the FBI seizure page and indictment from the DOJ... |
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erk
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August 09, 2017, 12:41:52 AM |
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i'd agree that this is likely not the real btc-e admins. i would assume that a number of fake phishing sites are being set up right now, just on the chance that btc-e relaunches in some capacity and tries to refund users. statistically, that's what this probably is.
but im curious: what makes you say that it is "most likely not under btc-e control?"
If BTC-e manage to get their servers up and running somewhere safer, I am sure they will let us know the URL. It doesn't pay to speculate on domain names as a sign of progress, they are the least of the problems. Getting hosting, IP's, DDoS protection, synced wallets etc. all has to be in place before then, and that's just to get crypto flowing, the tip of the iceberg. Getting fiat flowing is the mega-drama. |
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forzendiablo
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the grandpa of cryptos
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August 09, 2017, 01:24:59 AM |
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im sure btc-e will be back and will pay money off, BFX "lost" 60 mil and still works, BTC-E will also get back maybe with different name but money will be there, possibly just USD will be changed to USDT or so
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yolo
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MAbtc
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August 09, 2017, 06:37:09 AM |
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im sure btc-e will be back and will pay money off, BFX "lost" 60 mil and still works, BTC-E will also get back maybe with different name but money will be there, possibly just USD will be changed to USDT or so
I wish I had your confidence, but the Bitfinex situation was quite different. Bitfinex may have gotten a slap on the wrist from the CFTC, but they don't have the FBI and DOJ's criminal division chasing after the owners. At least as far as we know.  USDT might be tenable but I don't see how BTC-e could accumulate it. Their coins are also at risk of being blacklisted by exchanges (including USDT). If they come back, it will be a very interesting test of fungibility in bitcoin and other crypto. I don't have the greatest feeling about it.... |
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jojo69
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diamond-handed zealot
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August 09, 2017, 06:53:18 AM |
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is there a market where I can bet on this?
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This is not some pseudoeconomic post-modern Libertarian cult, it's an un-led, crowd-sourced mega startup organized around mutual self-interest where problems, whether of the theoretical or purely practical variety, are treated as temporary and, ultimately, solvable.
Censorship of e-gold was easy. Censorship of Bitcoin will be… entertaining.
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figmentofmyass
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August 09, 2017, 07:34:57 AM |
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i'd agree that this is likely not the real btc-e admins. i would assume that a number of fake phishing sites are being set up right now, just on the chance that btc-e relaunches in some capacity and tries to refund users. statistically, that's what this probably is.
but im curious: what makes you say that it is "most likely not under btc-e control?"
If BTC-e manage to get their servers up and running somewhere safer, I am sure they will let us know the URL. It doesn't pay to speculate on domain names as a sign of progress, they are the least of the problems. Getting hosting, IP's, DDoS protection, synced wallets etc. all has to be in place before then, and that's just to get crypto flowing, the tip of the iceberg. Getting fiat flowing is the mega-drama. i would think that the feds are subpoenaing theymos and Twitter for access to the btc-e accounts. we need some cryptographic proof of the domain they set up (if they do relaunch) from some of their known addresses. the feds could be setting up honeypots, and there's gonna be a hell of a lot of fake phishing sites trying to get your btc-e logins. given that bitfinex is still the biggest western exchange and still doesn't have fiat flowing, i'd say there's still a chance here.... is there a market where I can bet on this?
what kind of odds are you looking for?  |
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YesLOST
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August 09, 2017, 07:45:54 AM |
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Please tell me I am wrong! But I can't imagine any other story at the moment...
You are very wrong and have a very bad understanding of how bitcoin works. |
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YesLOST
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August 09, 2017, 07:51:25 AM |
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i would think that the feds are subpoenaing theymos and Twitter for access to the btc-e accounts. we need some cryptographic proof of the domain they set up (if they do relaunch) from some of their known addresses. the feds could be setting up honeypots, and there's gonna be a hell of a lot of fake phishing sites trying to get your btc-e logins.
I really do not care if the FBI sets up a pishing honeypot, they are criminals after all, and I would also try to login if this legit FBI phising site, so they would know already that there is somebody behind my account. But its just speculation, they do not have much funds after all. |
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jojo69
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diamond-handed zealot
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August 09, 2017, 07:52:43 AM |
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even odds
I would bet on the Slavic testes, as has been said before...they could have bailed at-any-time in the past, but did not
I am really hoping that the delay and silence just means that they are wrapping their brains around what this is going to require...I could be wrong
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This is not some pseudoeconomic post-modern Libertarian cult, it's an un-led, crowd-sourced mega startup organized around mutual self-interest where problems, whether of the theoretical or purely practical variety, are treated as temporary and, ultimately, solvable.
Censorship of e-gold was easy. Censorship of Bitcoin will be… entertaining.
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deisik
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English ⬄ Russian Translation Services
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August 09, 2017, 07:57:41 AM |
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i'd agree that this is likely not the real btc-e admins. i would assume that a number of fake phishing sites are being set up right now, just on the chance that btc-e relaunches in some capacity and tries to refund users. statistically, that's what this probably is.
but im curious: what makes you say that it is "most likely not under btc-e control?"
If BTC-e manage to get their servers up and running somewhere safer, I am sure they will let us know the URL. It doesn't pay to speculate on domain names as a sign of progress, they are the least of the problems. Getting hosting, IP's, DDoS protection, synced wallets etc. all has to be in place before then, and that's just to get crypto flowing, the tip of the iceberg. Getting fiat flowing is the mega-drama. i would think that the feds are subpoenaing theymos and Twitter for access to the btc-e accounts. we need some cryptographic proof of the domain they set up (if they do relaunch) from some of their known addresses. the feds could be setting up honeypots, and there's gonna be a hell of a lot of fake phishing sites trying to get your btc-e logins Do you refer to Btc-e accounts here, on Bitcointalk? Somehow subpoenaing theymos doesn't sound quite good and encouraging, though running a background forum (if it ever comes to that) is a lot easier than running an exchange or a mixer service. Regarding Bitfinex, what makes you think that it is in fact a Western exchange? Last time I checked they looked more like a Hong-Kong based operation (though things might have changed dramatically since then). Are you sure that you are not confusing them with BitStamp? |
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JoeMue
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August 09, 2017, 08:57:35 AM |
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Please tell me I am wrong! But I can't imagine any other story at the moment...
You are very wrong and have a very bad understanding of how bitcoin works. Then please tell me: why do they put such a huge effort in coin mixing and wallet splitting? There seems to be no time to keep customers updated about their progress of setting up a new exchange. But there is enough time to hide the customers coins. Yeah, sounds completely logical... My prediction: short post on sunday that they have trouble setting up a new exchange and need another 2 weeks. And they will advise us to keep calm. |
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stingray454
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August 09, 2017, 09:18:22 AM |
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Then please tell me: why do they put such a huge effort in coin mixing and wallet splitting?
One guess is that the FBI did not seize their cold storage wallet, but know where it is. By transferring the coins by mixing to other cold storage wallets, it will be harder to track (ie hard to prove that the "new" exchange has funds that is in any way connected to btc-e). |
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YesLOST
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August 09, 2017, 09:24:18 AM |
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Then please tell me: why do they put such a huge effort in coin mixing and wallet splitting? There seems
to be no time to keep customers updated about their progress of setting up a new exchange. But there
is enough time to hide the customers coins. Yeah, sounds completely logical...
My prediction: short post on sunday that they have trouble setting up a new exchange
and need another 2 weeks. And they will advise us to keep calm.
They are not silent. They said exactly what they are going to do. And they clearly said that they care about their customers. Why we should doubt their words now? All this talk about hiding/scamming coins is only possible if you neglect the fact that they have been very trustworthy the last 6 years and still are. Then, from a strategically point of view, it makes no sense to talk to the users and in the meanwhile trying to hide funds from them. They could have played dead while there was the FBI chaos. Much easier. Also, for users it does not matter where the coins are, because you cannot access them directly. Also, we do not know exactly if the mentioned wallets belong to btce. In reality, the only people btce wants to hide funds are the criminals of the fbi. |
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illinest
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August 09, 2017, 10:04:38 AM |
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Regarding Bitfinex, what makes you think that it is in fact a Western exchange? Last time I checked they looked more like a Hong-Kong based operation (though things might have changed dramatically since then). Are you sure that you are not confusing them with BitStamp?
They've always been a Western exchange. There's a reason they only have a BTCUSD market, not a BTCHKD market. They were/are registered in Hong Kong, but also organized in the British Virgin Islands. And I wouldn't be surprised if they are shifting things around. |
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Tigggger
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August 09, 2017, 10:43:44 AM |
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And the latest update via twitter ...
Update5! Important! 08/09/2017
Exit from the current situation with the arrested Fiat:
1. Last 14 days we were engaged in struggle for your means, it was possible to gain control over 55% of funds (depends on the course), the remaining 45% are arrested funds, the most part in fiat. As the arrest is withdrawn from the accounts, the amount will decrease.
2. What is the way out of the current situation we see:
2.1. Work under the current BTC-e brand is not possible due to unresolved issues from the Office of Financial Crimes of the US Treasury.
2.2. At the moment, we are negotiating with a group of investors (an investment company), about buying and prompt launch of the service and repaying debts to customers. Further, the process of repayment of debt obligations will be described in more detail.
2.3. After we transfer all balance sheets of the investment company, we will recalculate the balance sheets.
2.4. The conversion procedure, taking into account the available 55% of funds:
2.4.1. All liabilities for fiat (USD, EUR, RUR) will be transferred to BTE tokens (1 BTE is 1 USD) at the exchange rate on the date of conversion. Probably, for more operative closing of promissory notes, ICO will be held on BTE tokens.
2.4.2. If you have on the balance the amount in koin, then you will be written off 45% of the balance of coins and credited with 45% of BTE (1 BTE is 1 USD). At the exchange rate on the day of conversion.
2.4.3. If you have a balance in BTE, then you will be credited with 45% in coins (the sum will be divided into 7 different coins equally BTC, LTC, NMC, NVC, PPC, ETH, DSH) and write off the amount of 45% in BTE.
2.4.4. Upon all recalculations, all users will have the opportunity to withdraw 55% of their funds from the system.
2.5. The investment company works in compliance with KYC, AML and the licenses required for this activity, so all users will need to undergo verification.
2.6. Tentative start dates end of August.
3. All debt obligations will be closed primarily from operating income from the investment company's commission, as well as from the funds we plan to sue from those who illegally arrested them.
The closing of the debt will be based on the principle of buying BTE tokens from the market.
The next update will provide more details on the procedure for accessing information on your balance sheet and when these funds can be withdrawn.
From the BTC-e team we officially inform that all the funds that were in the reserve fund (including all our income) were transferred to pay off the debts.
P.S. A warning! The cases of posting fake links on allegedly our new domain have become more frequent. All official information about our service is placed only in our twitter and from our official account on the forum.
Sincerely, BTC-e team
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