Stand Up Paddle > Gear Talk
Demise of the Traditional Downwinder Board
Just Cruising:
There has been a trend lately from the major sup manufacturers to big noses (Fanatic Falcon, SB Ace, NSP DC) and flattened rockers (Naish Glide) instead of the traditional style Downwinder like the old Glides, Angulo Shaka, Jimmy Lewis M14 and SIC boards. I have even read some of the new Bullets are flattening there rockers out.
I admit the new shapes I gave as examples are racing crossover boards but the comments coming from those who have ridden generally state how impressed they are with them on downwind runs. There may have even been the odd “best ever” thrown in there.
Are we witnessing the demise of the traditional rockered big gun style downwinder? Is there still a place for them outside the unlimited M2O boards or are they relics of SUP’s surfing origins?
balance_fit:
Hmmm, this thread promises to be hot soon. I'm no dw expert, in fact, I prefer surf than dw. But, a good dw run, with peers, on a well aligned course is as much fun as a glassy day with light offshore winds in surf....well, not as much fun, but close...
I understand that rockered designs on narrow gun style boards have their use in a particular set of conditions, say, nuking, steep runs, choppy, etc.
Same as flatter rockered boards with blunt noses, or narrower tails a'la Starboard Ace, good for groomed small light dw'ers.
Take length, width. Some conditions will favor a particular sized board, say, wider for stability on choppier waters.
Paddler's size also might influence dw gear choice. A 120 lb paddler in light winds might favor a subtle rocker on a very light board such as a BOP shape, instead of a rockered board on a 14' size.
I feel that the development of those flatter, blunt nosed shapes follows and evolution in the dw specific gear. Now we can choose from well designed boards for specific conditions.
Area 10:
I think it is more the case that few people will be so into DW that they will buy a board just for that activity. Serious DWing is potentially dangerous and it's logistically typically a big commitment. Most people want a board which can double up as a recreational flat water racer and maybe also fitness and touring board, because DW is only gonna be something they are going to do a few times a year.
Full-on gun style heavily-rockered boards suck in flat water as much as pure flatwater boards suck in big DW conditions. Most people want a mid-ground board. So, you put on a hybrid nose that is part planing and part displacement, and you lower the rocker and make the rails softer. That makes the board faster in flat water, but still DWable in little stuff for most people, and in bigger stuff for the experienced.
I think that for full-on conditions you are probably always going to be better off on a dedicated gun-style planing nose board. Soft railed boards are slower to get planing and then usually harder to control once they are. The small volume of the gun boards' noses also reduces the swing weight and windage making quick direction changes easier for chasing the bumps. But the vast majority of potential buyers are probably never going to venture out in anything much over 25 knots and thigh-high bumps.
Just Cruising:
Good points, makes perfect sense to build boards for conditions that 90% of your market are going to paddle in. Also because most of the new flagship boards are race boards they have to be fast in a wide range of conditions.
Took another look at the post with the SIC catalog and they are actually continuing to make a lot of heavily rockered DW boards. Perhaps this is a smart move to offer something different from their competitors who are converging on similar designs. Naish are really doing their own thing with the LE and new glide so you have to give them respect for that.
I find it fascinating seeing what the different manufacturers come up with. I think they could do a better job explaining the evolution though. I am a little skeptical of the Starboard Allstar. Why would a board change so dramatically after one year? Same thing with the Fanatic Falcon. It smacks of building in obsolescence.
Area 10:
--- Quote from: Just Cruising on October 03, 2013, 06:00:49 PM --- Naish are really doing their own thing with the LE and new glide so you have to give them respect for that.
I find it fascinating seeing what the different manufacturers come up with. I think they could do a better job explaining the evolution though. I am a little skeptical of the Starboard Allstar. Why would a board change so dramatically after one year? Same thing with the Fanatic Falcon. It smacks of building in obsolescence.
--- End quote ---
The 2014 Naish Glide shares many features with the Coreban Dart. The very end of the nose is different but the general concept is similar, except Naish have oriented it to be a bit more flatwater oriented, to appeal to a larger potential customer base.
And I agree about the large changes year to year of some brands. I think what they are doing is trying to give people a reason to update in some cases. But they may also be working to a 2-year design cycle on some features- in other words eg. make a board slightly more flatwater oriented one year and then return it to more ocean oriented the next. So if the design direction they have taken this year doesn't suit you then wait til next year and it probably will. So with the 2014 Naish Glide 14 they have gone for stability and touring crossover appeal. Next year they will probably make it narrower so more out and out race and FW oriented. There are only so many things you can do with a design and an average customer with a particular set of needs is more likely to update every other year than every year - every year is beyond the means of all but sponsored riders and rich over-competitive types. Well, that's how I'd be thinking about positioning my design differences in their place anyway. You'd have to think beyond just what you are going to do next year if you want to be successful in the long run. So the All Star goes a bit more flatwater oriented this year and next we'll probably see a cross-over design like the All Star but with a bigger volume nose (and with possibly a new name). That's my guess anyway.
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