Lily Firered, who is Xenu?

I do not know exactly. Take my answer as from someone who has heard
about Xenu only via the internet, and I would recommend not to trust
scientology related information if one got it only through the
internet, since this is one of the places which the church of
scientology tries to manipulate via misinformation.

As far as I know Xenu is a figure in one of the sci-fi stories of L.Ron
Hubbard, an american sci-fi author from the 1950. Obvioulsy it is one
of the bad guys and probably Xenu is seen by some scientologists as
something which they believe in as an evil warlord and in some kind
they even make a "kult" out of it, which means they try to bring Xenu
to the attention of the Wog-world (wog= scientologese for non
scientologists). But - the Wog-world seems not to be too scared by that
Alien :-) so they try harder and harder to install this fantasy-figure
in the minds of the people.

Personally I think that it could be a kind of test also for
scientologists, (but I can err here): They say that this is the secret
of OT III (a state of rank in sctlgy) and that could be true, but I
think that there at least exists an internet version of that story and
that one which the people in the church of stlgy get when they pay for
ot 3 is at least slightly (or maybe completely) different. I think that
they could know each others by knowing some word or expression or
detail of that story which has been altered for the internet. And those
who know that detail (or might it be the complete story, I don't know)
they will e.g. repeat the false version or false detail and ridicule it
and then the other ot 3+ will know that here is another true ot3+ and
so on. It is very weird, anyway. On the other hand, I think it gives
the scientologists also a kind of good feeling, because they think they
have fooled someone, if someone repeats that (probably altered) story
or writes about it in the media. And then they can blame the people and
say: "This is not true. They are all liars, see he is critical of stlgy
but he has no idea, not even the Xenu story is right, watch that" and
so on. Ridiculous on its own of course.

Scientologists, I can tell you one thing: that Xenu story has nothing
to do with the truth at all. A Xenu or such does not exist, has never
existed and is a complete construction from a person with
50-trash-horrormovie-fantasy, a certain Ron Hubbard.

No reason to fear that guy, neither Xenu, nor Hubbard. Should you feel
you are in trouble if you name him or so, please believe me, there is
nothing behind that picture which the ch.of sctlgy put into your mind
only to scare you and to manipulate and control you. There is no Xenu
out there, he does not exist. What exists is the fear in your mind.

Don't fight Xenu.
Fight the fear in your mind.

FIGHT THAT AWFUL FEAR IN YOUR MIND, GUYS!

I embrace you.

.Lily.

Here's the creator of this cult, L. Ron Hubbard's own hand writing
about Xenu
http://www.xenu.net/archive/OTIII-scholar/

Here's a breakdown of his writing and the full story
http://www.xs4all.nl/%7Ekspaink/fishman/ot3.html

Here's audio from L. Ron Hubbard explaining Xenu and the space opera
called scientology
http://www.scientomogy.com/xenu_space_opera.php

Former scientologist that made it past OT3 will all tell you the same
story about Xenu and this galactic space opera that L. Ron Hubbard made
up to steal people's money.

This is crap. As a Scientologists I can assure you that Xenu plays as good
as no role in my religion. It is like saying that PP (Pontius Pilatus) is
the main belief of the Christians.

I personally believe that Xenu wasn't one person but a bunch of time track
psychs.

Moreover, be reminded that L. Ron Hubbard was constantly forged and just a
fool believes what haters of Scientology put on their sites.

Barbara Schwarz (Looking for the original Mark [Marty] Rathbun. No
impostor, please!)

--
http://www.thunderstar.net/~Schwarz/
(I am concerned about Dave Touretzky's activities. He also has bomb
instructions on the net.) http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.org/extremists/

Brian J. Bruns plays a "cop" on the net but he is a felon (computer crimes),
a spammer, an anti-free speech activist, and the abusive AHBL website is
his. He lies about me on his website. He is the abuser!

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.scientology/msg/70fdd710bf99c37a?dmode=source&hl=en

<dan acroyd voice> barbara you ignorant slut...... We all know the
gist of OT# just 'cause you didnt have enough $$ to give toe Co$ to get
there doesnt mean it aint as Ron writes it...... I would say face the
fact but your so far gone that only a lithium enema would help ya now

Tony
The Cardinal

You also suggest that Scientology critics get their information about
this "xenu" entity from forged documents. Are you saying that Hubbard
never wrote about xenu, and that the whole story of him being an evil
system lord who brought alien souls to earth millions of years ago is
not part of the Scientology belief system?

This is Scientology's main belief. Xenu is the main belief of
Scientology. Xenu leads to alien clusters which leads to auditing
which leads to people losing all their money, friends and family, which
then leads people to finding sites like http://www.xenu.net or
http://www.lermanet.com for help on leaving the cult. A vishish cycle.

I buy walking on water, turning water into whine, David Blaine
levitating any day of the week compared to that Xenu bullshit.
Bullshit, called The Church of Scientology.

The bible is based on the writings of many brilliant scholars, judges
and even kings. Who's to say what is %100 true or just based around an
event that could have happened. Regardless, it wasn't written by one
drug using, lying, con artist, who was not a war hero but just a hack
1950's science fiction writer.

If they are OT3 or higher they have to believe this or they wouldn't
have been able to move higher on the bridge.

No, I've personally talked to many ex-scientologist OT3 and higher and
they all have the same story to tell.

I hope one day you are able to open up your eyes and get the help you
need.

This is a scientology news board

Still pending, but thanks for your concern. That really means alot to
me.

It probably wasn't Scientology, but it was enough for the F.B.I, Mesa
detectives and long time critics to believe Scientology had something
to do with it. There's a lot of people on A.R.S. that still think I'm a
moron because of this event, and they might be right. I didn't know all
the facts myself before posting this incident on OCMB and that's my
fault. I don't remember anything. I really don't. I didn't drink
more than a few beers that night. I wouldn't stay up drinking till
11am on a Tuesday and then drive to work where I was in charge of the
whole web design department. I don't think I've ever dranken alcohol
before noon in my whole life except maybe when I've been camping.
Anyway - I've moved on, some people haven't. I've never been in jail
before but I'll deal with whatever consequences may be coming to me.
I'm not afraid of anything. If you have faith and are a good decent
person, things will always work out for you eventually.

Hard to understand you but I'll try and answer anyway-

I do lots of websites for companies. That was one of them. There is
nothing illegal about the products they sold. They sold mailnly shot
glasses. Guys and yes, even girls use shot glasses to consume alcohol.
It's a sad, sad world.

>Fred Durks is Paul Horner

yes, and how do scientologist know this? Because their church hires
private investigators to find out every detail about the people that
don't believe what they believe. They even call your work and harrass
your fellow co-workers.
http://www.scientomogy.com/scientology_pi.php

Their lawyers try and shut down your websites
http://www.scientomogy.com/aliens.php

It's a nice "church".

The "church" of scientology is not a big fan of free speech. Free
speech equates to less clones, and less clones means no "church" of
scientology.

Hey you fucking fruit loop, I don't have anything to do with that
company. I don't promote anything they do. There are hundreds of
companies that sell the EXACT same products they do. You have to be 21
to buy alcohol. What you do with the alchohol after that is your own
choice.

Negative, ghostrider

You know as fucking well as I do that Ron demanded that all of his
writings be held as exact technical truth. To imply allegory is a high,
high crime.

People can believe in fucking goats as a religion, I don't care. What
I do care about is educating people about the real truths behind your
religion before they think about joining. You can stary a night at
Motel 8, read the bible and know what's really behind the Catholic
faith. They don't hide anything. They don't need to.

With scientology you don't find out about all the evils and bullshit
until you get pretty deep into it. By then this means they've taken
most of your money, seperated you from friends and family who are not
believers in your new cult that you've joined, and you have nothing to
fall back on except scientology and L. Ron Hubbard's drug induced
hallucinations as a religion. Sounds like a pretty shitty life to me.

What he is doing here is classic Scientology.

Try to attack the critic, do anything to change the focus away from the
subject of Scientology's evil practices.

Textbook PR

As far as picking up a Gideon Bible at Motel 8 and discovering what the
"Catholic" faith is, Paul, you show your ignorance. There is a secret
and hidden side to Christianity that the general public knows nothing
of. As Christ himself said, don't show the swine your pearls; they
wouldn't understand anyway. That's why He spoke in metaphore and
parables, so that the general uneducated population could have a chance
of receiving some of these pearls, though veiled in allusion, that was
planted in their consciousness to develop. Not all of those who
listened to Jesus became wise or free. Some of the seeds landed on
unfertile ground.

I suggest that you start reading, broadening your horizon and not get
stuck in this Scientology quagmire, where you have obviously been stuck
for a long time. If you want to stop war don't go to an anti-war
rally...go to a peace rally.

never accused you of being a scientologist. Everything else you wrote
has nothing to do with this thread.

Here's the creator of this cult, L. Ron Hubbard's own hand writing
about Xenu
http://www.xenu.net/archive/OTIII-scholar/

Former scientologists that made it past OT3 will all tell you the same

But dodgeismyname, Opinions and others, you *are* a Froot Loop!

--
Ron of that ilk.

Oh, I remember now! You're that Froot Loop who keeps pushing the fcc.net
site in hopes someone might think that it's fcc.gov.

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Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 06:08:47 -0500
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Basic Moral Education manual
http://my.fcc.net/~workgroup5/sup/basic-manual.htm

Let's see now. You're passionately concerned about the
Xenu/packaged-frozen-souls-transported-from-other-planets-to-Earth-in-space-planes/OT
3 writings being exposed. You present the standard propaganda lines on
"OT 3." ("How do you know? Because you read it on line?" And, "These
are allegorical tales," etc.)

Well, I, personally, read the materials on _paper_, in their original
form, and the materials are meant to be taken literally; and to be a
Scientologist on "OT 3," and to suggest otherwise, would be a "High
Crime."

However, when "handling" outsiders, such misrepresentation of what
Hubbard actually wrote, would, of course, be a typical "PR handling."

You write, almost mockingly, about the beliefs of Christians, yet you
later claim to be _not_ a Scientologist, but a Catholic.

Ho hum.

Not another one of these.

Tedious.

Don't you ever tire of lying?

I didn't mock the beliefs of Christians, all I asked Fred was it not
true that the beliefs of Scientologists are just as far out as
Christians, but I could have said Moslems, Bahais, Wikkins or any other
metaphysical system. People have a right, in my opinion, to pursue and
believe whatever they want. Don't you agree?

As I said before, I'll accept any consequences that come from this.
I'm ready to move on, some people are not.

Possibly not, however, the Church of Scientology believes you should PAY
to get that information, while the Christians have been handing it out
for free for a couple of centuries.

Mr. Hubbard stated the information about Xenu was factual. This presents
a dilemna for Scientologists who encounter the material.

I believe in wearing your favorite clothes until they fall right off of
you in rags.

Peach
--
Extra! Extra! Read All About It!
Save some dough, save some grief:
http://www.xenu.net
http://www.scientology-lies.com

Remember that Lily is not supposed to be, or have ever been, a member
of Scientology. She's supposed to be, simply, an interested
non-Scientologist who is also a critic of Scientology, and the
supporter of the "true critic of Scientology," 'Truth Seeker'.

That's Lily's "suitable guise," when she's being Lily.

> those who remain? Besides, how do you know that genuine Scientologists

I believe Scientology is a big, fat global SCAM masquerading as a religion.

--
--
Barb
Chaplain, ARSCC
xenu...@netscape.net

"Every week, every month, every year, every decade and now
every century, Scientology does weird and stupid things
to damage its own reputation."
-Steve Zadarnowski

"Comparing Scientology to a motorcycle gang is a gross, unpardonable
insult to bikers everywhere. Even at our worst, we are never as bad as
Scientology."
-ex-member, Thunderclouds motorcycle "club"

"$cientology sees the world this way: One man with a picket sign:
terrorism. Five thousand people dead in a deliberate inferno: business
opportunity.

$cientology oozes _under_ terrorists to hide."
-Chris Leithiser

I knew a couple of hippies who worked on weapons systems for missiles in
the northwest. Their justification was, "if we didn't do it, somebody
else would."

You always have the choice to tell a company that you are morally
opposed to their products. Like the "trick" shot glass. That is just
reprehensible, as it clearly targets naive young women. But, whatever.
I don't agree with your choice and I wouldn't have taken that project.
Results amongst hominids may vary, however.

Nobody gives a rats ass about the beliefs of Scientology. It is the
criminal, antisocial, fraudulent behavior and abuse we protest.
I'm surprised you haven't managed to wrap your little brain around that
concept yet. Repeat until cognition: 'It's not about the beliefs, it's
about the abuses of people and the law.'

Got it yet?

Well, gee, maybe it's because you SOUND JUST LIKE A SCIENTOLOGIST!
Think that might be it?

What you've written below is straight out of the Big Book of Arguments.
You're imagining Lord Xenu's mental condition.
You exhort Lord Xenu to back away from criticising Scientology "for her
own good."
And you conclude by telling Lord Xenu to "get a life."
Straight out of the manual. Whence this phony "concern" over the
well-being of others?

You have no idea as to this individual's mental state. Like past
Scientologists who post here, you live a rich fantasy life about the
emotional state of others and how they spend their time.

Ah, yes, the old 'you could have a problem that stems from criticising
Scientology.' Addicted to forums and the internet. Recommends SSRIs,
nice touch. No Scientologist would EVER recommend psych drugs! Got it.

Oh, go fuck yourself, you sanctimonious twit! If you don't like ARS,
take a hike. Maybe YOU have a mental problem! Do you like whacking
yourself with a hammer because it feels so good when you stop?
Who the fuck do you think you are, to be issuing this crappy advice?
Take your peace, love, health and abundance and shove it up your corn
chute, you pompous, self-satisfied jerk! How about you tend to your own
life instead of imposing your unwanted advice onto others?

> wrong in calling you a fruit loop. You're just a pathetic scieno
> troll.
>
Hehe...but he thinks we'll NEVER KNOW, because he says he's not a
Scieno. Never mind that his posts sound just like those of other people
who start off their first post, "I am not a Scientologist, but..."

Heh. Recommending SSRIs was a nice touch. No Scientologist would EVER
recommend psych drugs. Right? ;)

They don't have the right to harass, intimidate, libel, slander, stalk
and otherwise try to destroy people who criticize them. Don't you agree?

No, we haven't forgotten. However, that's not the issue, is it? Why turn
it around into an attack on Fred? It's almost like you're trying to
divert the thread's topic away from something...what could it be?

Maybe the fact that you claim not to be a member of Scientology and just
"happen" to sound like one? Hmmmm?

Regardless, the issue isn't whether or not you're a Scientologist. The
issue seems to be that you're out there bloviating about religious
rights to people who are opposed to religious wrongs; stalking,
criminality, harassment, abuse.

You just can't quite get that concept, can you? Slowly now...WE ARE NOT
OPPOSED TO SCIENTOLOGY BELIEFS. WE ARE OPPOSED TO THE ABUSE OF PEOPLE
AND THE LAW. And fraud. Don't forget fraud. And libel. And slander. And
practicing medicine without a license and giving bad medical advice
and...and...you're not getting it, are you. :(

There is a huge difference between calling you a sanctimonious twit on a
newsgroup, and the cult sending someone around my neighborhood posing as
a cop and telling people I am a terrorist and a drug dealer.

Can you see the difference?

Dear Cereal:

Whatever offense, imagined or otherwise, that you want to lay on barbz
doesn't change the fact that, as she said, "Nobody gives a rats ass

fraudulent behavior and abuse we protest" and "They don't have the

destroy people who criticize them."

Barb is *not* the one charging people money for pretend therapy and
purposely hiding information about it until after the victim pays out a
quarter of a million dollars. She is *not* the one trying to destroy
anyone who criticizes her. Your cult is. No matter what Barb does, you
can't defend that.

It's obvious that you don't even know the definition of slander and
libel, or you wouldn't have mentioned both of them in this context here.
You are demonstratively a sanctimonious twit. Anyone who reads your
posts can draw that conclusion.

Now then, if I knew your real name and called you a drug dealing
pedophile here BY NAME, or put up a web page with your name and the
accusation that you're a dog-beating meth user, or went door to door
telling people you whore out your daughter for crack funds, THAT would
be libel and slander.

I hope this clarifies this for you, with your anonymous nickname.
You can't be libeled or slandered, you stupid assclown. I don't even
know your name. Sheesh.

Well, dumbass, I hope I've clarified the definitions for you a little
bit. Hopefully, there's at least a dull glimmer of intelligence
flickering behind your eyes sufficient enough to grasp what I'm saying.

Sorry, I meant hfdhgfkjhfgjhf <hfdhgfk...@hfdhgfkjhfgjhf.com> is
"Opinions" and not you.

Having said that, let's just have a running dialogue and try to
understand one another. OK? I'm a 57 year old man living in
Massachusetts who has never been involved in Scientology in any way,
and only became interested in it when Tom Curise jumped the couch and
attracted attention to the subject. You can call me by my real
nickname, "Will." I've done a lot of reading, and have come to the
conclusion that L. Ron Hubbard's "religious technology" is based on
active imagination culled from thousands of e-meter sessions, which are
of course essentially hypnotic in nature, suggestive. The space opera
about the marcabians, xenu the Supreme Ruler of the Galactic
Confederation, the story of how our univers was built as a prison 86
trillion years ago and how thetans have gone through implant stations,
and so much more...this came from what Hubbard called his "research,"
which was writing down the ramblings of preclears during auditing and
weaving it all into an elaborate science fiction story.

What interests me are the people who decide to embrace Ron's "tech,"
and claim all kinds of wins, say that they have developed incredible
powers and abilities by becoming at cause over the MEST universe...yet
not one of them can do as much as move a paper clip with their minds.
It's obvious to me that they are deluded, that by working the Bridge to
Total Freedom they have become mentally ill due to their association
with the methods of Scientology. As one who has a history in the
mental health profession, now retired, I find these people fascinating.
I find the whole subject of cults interesting and this is why I come
here and other sites once in a while to read and sometimes post.

That's it? That's all that interests you here? So what's this about:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.scientology/msg/262c514689059d63?hl=en&
?

Day one you said it was your personal mission to stop me. Your posts
are just the same as any other scieno troll - "I'm interested in
learning more about why scientology gets such a bad rap", "Truth
Seeker seems like a good critic, listen to him". You change topics,
post gibberish about the war or terrorism...... you do what it takes to
make it all go away. But it won't go away. The critic movement is
strong, and it's only getting stronger. Your kind won't be along too
much longer. You'll be looking for a new religion in the want ads soon
enough. Live it up while you still can.

Because you were having a dialog about Xenu, the Bible, etc., and then
responded to Fred's input on the subject by bringing up a drunk driving
charge. What does someone's drunk driving charge have to do with a
conversation about Xenu, the Bible, or Scientology beliefs? Just
sounded kind of mean and petty, not to mention off-topic.

As for the petitions. They might not change anything legally, but they
get people talking. Talking leads to people researching and learning,
and then passing on that information. That's good enough for me.

Let's see how many people I have gotten to talk and spread the word
about this cult in the past 12 months or less.

Sign the petition to boycott Tom Cruise and Mission Impossible 3
http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/boycottmi3
Signatures: 1910

Sign the petition to have The Church of Scientology tax-exemption
status removed!
http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/stopscientology
Signatures: 6142

Sign the petition to revoke Tom Cruises American Citizenship!
http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/tomcruise
Signatures: 2908

That's well over 10,000 signatures in a short amount of time. Add that
to the few thousand visitors I get to my critic sites a day and I'd say
I'm doing pretty well.

scientologists, (but I can err here): They say, that this is the secret

think, that there could exist an internet version of that story parallel
to that official one, which the people in the church of stlgy get when
they pay for ot 3. It could be that the internet version is at least

I think that scientologists could know each others by knowing some word

story, I don't know) could e.g. repeat the false version or false detail
and ridicule it and then the other ot 3+s will know, that here is
another true ot3+ and so on, because he or she is so obviously "in the
know". It is very weird, anyway.

all liars, see, he is critical of stlgy but he has no idea, not even the

No reason to fear that guy, neither Xenu, nor Hubbard. Should you feel,

I embrace you.

original from Ms whosnameisprobablykillfileddotLILYdotFIRERED

What good does getting signatures to revoke Tom Cruise's citezenship
do? It seems a useless endeavor, it will never happen. I agree with
the revokation of the Church of Scientology's tax-exemption status
though. How's that going? Do you think that will work? How far has
that gone? Does that have to go through Congress, and who are you
talking with to make it happen other than collecting signatures?

about X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu only via the internet,

of the bad guys and probably X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu

X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu

X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu story is right, watch that"

X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu story has nothing

X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu or such does not exist, has

X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu, nor Hubbard. Should you feel,

X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu

Don't fight X(in-case-you-had-to-killfile-this-word)enu.

Just so there's no confusion about who Xenu is and how he is the main
belief of this cult. Let's go to the source of this drug induced
science fiction story called scientology.

Here's the creator of this cult, L. Ron Hubbard's own hand writing
about Xenu
http://www.xenu.net/archive/OTIII-scholar/

Here's a breakdown of his writing and the full story
http://www.xs4all.nl/%7Ekspaink/fishman/ot3.html

Here's audio from L. Ron Hubbard explaining Xenu and the space opera
called scientology
http://www.scientomogy.com/xenu_space_opera.php

Oh- and L. Ron did drugs too
http://www.xenu.net/archive/hubbardcoroner/hubbard_toxicology_report.jpg

And..... he was NOT a war hero
http://www.scientomogy.com/stolenvalor.php

Former scientologist that made it past OT3 will all tell you the same
story about Xenu and this galactic space opera that L. Ron Hubbard made
up to steal people's money.

Oh, ok. Thanks. So what's this all about:
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/OTIII/ ?

<snip>

Boy, that's a load of bullshit. You're saying that the story of Xenu and
OT III on the internet was put together by the Church of Scientology to
discredit critics? Why would they do that? To make themselves look even
more foolish? Frankly, many versions of the Xenu story are now in
circulation in the media which are not entirely accurate, because they
are written by people who haven't had a long time interest in
Scientology, but are quite happy to make fun of it in this new era of
popularity for Xenu. The public doesn't appear to care, and seems quite
entranced with the shorthand and not quite accurate versions.

Lily, you're as full of it as ever.

Peach

But, but, but, since she's spreading her spam over 3 faked names now, each
*individual* fake name/identity is 'less' full of it... Supposedly I
suppose.

And, less spammy too!

Zinj
--
But what you don't seem to realize, Roadrunner, is that what you've read
assimilated you. - Michael Reuss

Tu Quoque

> Besides, how do you know that genuine Scientologists
> believe such things?

True Scotsman.

> Because you read it online? Perhaps these are
> all allegorical tales

From: http://www.xenu.net/archive/OTIII-scholar/minton-essay.txt

The following comments were made by an ex-Scientology auditor and Case
Supervisor named Caroline Letkeman, who was highly trained (Class IX) to
administer the Scientology "technology" on the Upper Levels of Scientology's
Bridge, including OT3:

In order for scn (Scientology) to "work" at the upper levels, the person
must accept the OT 3 incident as a literal and factual matter. If the
person does not experience the fragmented condition as a "conscious
and literal fact", or if he cannot accept Hubbard's interpretation of
the psychological phenomena expected at this level, the person is
labeled a "bypassed case" and is sent back to redo his lower levels...

There is no getting around this point technically--either the incident
is real and "processible" or the person has not validly made his lower
grades...

> designed to relate a story for spiritual growth,
> as in the Eleusinian Mysteries and Pagan Rites. Fact is, you really
> don't know, you assume. But that's OK, your opinions mean little to
> those who have a belief. What do you believe in?
>
>

These things can be concluded from your postings, which deliberately
ignore the fact that most people who criticize Scientology, criticize
its behavior, not its beliefs.

Did not. I simply pointed out that your arguments are very similar to
those used repeatedly by cult sock puppets. I don't know if you're a
Scientologist, a Tom Cruise fan, or somebody who wandered into ARS
looking for chocolate milk.

I guess you missed the whole point of my use of ad hominem in
communicating with you. Lesson: identify and define libel and slander.
Explain when either becomes actionable. You are welcome to review my
previous posts and define any libel or slander as such if you need to.

I'm sure it's an entertaining diversion for you, but it isn't remotely
related to my interest in the cult.

They're real big on relying on anecdotal tall tales and calling it
evidence. They're also very, very shy when asked to demonstrate the
tiniest glimmer of any superhuman abilities, preferring to fall back on
the dead-end statement, "Scientology has helped me in my life," or
variations thereon.

Let's say you're not involved in Scientology in any way, but you're
interested in people's right to practice their religious beliefs.
Scientology's belief system states that it is perfectly ethical to lie,
and to suppress the human rights of outsiders.

You seem to have segued from a discussion of free will, where you
contend that people are responsible for actions based on faulty or
misleading information.

Then you move into comparison of Christian and Scientology beliefs,
completely ignoring the fact that nobody gives a rats ass about their
beliefs. You follow up with an all-out attack on Fred Durks' character,
which serves no purpose in supporting your discussion. You also attack
Lord Xenu by suggesting a shared insanity with Barbara Schwarz.

And now you're whining about me calling you names, and sniveling about
libel because I called you a dumbass and an assclown? Apparently you
don't even know what libel and slander actually is, or you wouldn't have
written that. I don't even know the reason behind your presence here.
WHAT IS YOUR FUCKING POINT, MAN? WHY ARE YOU EVEN WASTING OUR TIME WITH
YOUR SHIT?

Are you here to discuss religious rights? You won't find anyone to argue
with. It is the actions of the "church" of Scientology most people here
take exception to.

Are you here to snipe at critics and use smear tactics to discredit
them? If you are, don't be surprised when people mistake you for a
Scientologist.

It hardly get crazier than fanatical and defaming Barbzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
"Babbles" Graham. She is adopted, which means Xenu could be her
biological father!

:)

--
Barbara Schwarz (Looking for the original Mark (Marty) Rathbun. No
impostor, please!)
http://www.thunderstar.net/~schwarz/lrh/fbidocs.html

--
http://www.thunderstar.net/~Schwarz/
(I am concerned about Dave Touretzky's activities. He also has bomb
instructions on the net)
http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.org/extremists/

Victoria (Tory) Christman was on drugs and also experimented with
heroin. If not for Scientology, she might have died. She now defames L.
Ron Hubbard, Scientology and Scientologists who salvaged her from her
destructive "lifestyle".
http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.org/_vti_bin/shtml.dll/search.html

"I made my typical, totally evaluative decision without ANY real
facts."
Tory Christman, 27 Jun 2001, Message-ID:
<3B3A9693...@worldnet.att.net

So what? At least my parents wanted me. Yours pay you to stay the hell
away!

Hi Barb,
I'm not sure I understand the distinction you're trying to make. Isn't abuse of people and the law part of SCN "scripture"? Didn't Hubbard advocate disconnection, fairgame, 'always attack, never defend', purification rundown, etc. I get the impression that what Hubbard said and wrote became doctrine to be followed literally and without question. If that's the case then spacecooties AND abuse are part of the basic tenets of his little "church". I'm not trolling, it's really an honest question, thanks.