Sessler's Soapbox is Tired of the Bigots on Xbox Live
Posted by Jonathan on Wednesday, June 11th, 2008 at 9:26 pm under Game Companies, Game Consoles, Gamer Life, Microsoft, Microsoft, Videos
For this week’s Sessler’s Soapbox, Adam Sessler brings up an issue that’s old, but still unfortunately valid. That is, he, like many people, is fed up with the amount of racist and homophobic talk on Xbox Live. As he points out, the situation is just getting uglier all the time. Personally, I just mute the headset from the start as a default. Occasionally I’ll crank up the volume to see if there’s any sort of reasonable talk going on, and I’m usually disappointed…in humanity. Sessler also calls on anyone out there to explain why this sort of talk is necessary. You can check out how that’s going at the video’s website here.
I can’t remember where exactly I saw this, but an article I once read brought up a good theory on why this sort of behavior is more prevalent on Xbox Live over other online gaming forums. Part of the reason stems just from the fact that the Xbox 360 comes with a headset right out of the box, rather than having one sold separately. The thing is, the person who goes out of their way to purchase an extra headset is more likely use it to simply socialize and coordinate in the game. When it’s already there, some people tend to just put it on and start talking. It really is getting worse and worse, though.
If you found this story interesting, why not subscribe to our RSS feed to get your daily fix of gaming news?
June 11th, 2008 at 9:35 pm
The main reason is the simple fact that the vast majority of people on there are young American males.
June 11th, 2008 at 10:01 pm
Norbit stupid don't know a country
but i do agree i hate the talk during live games that why i think pc games are a lot better you can ban the idiots rather then mute them plus it more satifing
June 11th, 2008 at 10:23 pm
Huh, well. I blame the parents. 1: Not paying attention to their kids. 2: Letting them use the headset mic. 3: For buying their young children, X-Box 360s and crap. I also blame the kids. 1: They think they sound cool, they don't. 2: They should really behave themselves, anywhere. Becuase, alot of people. Hate hearing little wankers, cursing, and crap like that. 3: You should really be quiet. Now, I'm fifteen, but I know when to talk, when to be quiet. And all that. I swear rarely when playing on any online game. Why? Becuase, I find swearing only to be used in situations when they call for it. Like, you get shot. Go ahead, if you own some "n00b" online. I'm sick, and so are alot of people over this matter. Kids should just STFU OR GTFO.
June 11th, 2008 at 10:25 pm
To clarify, that "To get shot" one, was a real-life situation.
June 11th, 2008 at 10:45 pm
It's an unfortunate truth that when people can hide behind the anonymity of an online handle, they tend to behave in ways they wouldn't in person. Furthermore, parents simply aren't parenting anymore. If my son was sitting his room yelling profanities into his headset, then he would quickly lose that headset, along with the 360 it was attached to.
Simply put, this is an issue that crops up when you combine younger people who think profanity is 'cool' with an environment that rarely if ever punishes them for it. Maybe if more people took the time to report these morons, then Microsoft would take some sort of action against them.
June 11th, 2008 at 11:03 pm
True dat. I used to play CSS (Counter-Strike: Source), on almost every server. There is always that little kid, like. 11 years old. Swearing, getting angry, and most of the older people on that server, hate them. God, It's the same with when a girl gets on, they hear them talk. then it's a flood of "OMG A GRL" "NO its prlly a guy" "R u hott" "Cn I c u nakd?" Sadly, I've heard alot of those. The parents should really monitor and punish their kids. And the kids should learn to control it.
June 11th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
It's pretty naive to think this problem exists on one platform, much less to a particular demographic. This sort of thing has been going on since the days of Quake deathmatch. Microsoft does take action, but you have to have strong evidence to support such (hint: rare). Bungie has been pretty good about moderating this type of stuff, but even their resources are strained.
Historically, the most successful way to combat this kind of stuff, albeit crude, is for the game developer to incorporate some type of admin stuff specifically for the title. But even that has its drawbacks - especially if said game has limited popularity.
But I wholeheartedly agree, the blame is solely on the parents. It's a losing battle on the other end, regardless of devices used.
June 12th, 2008 at 12:06 am
Certain gaming avenues attract different age groups or cultures. This doesnt necessarily mean that the game itself is what attracts a playerbase. It is often the existing playerbase that determines who sticks around and who turns away in disgust.
What you're saying, Sessler, is merely an overly wordy and dramatized version of not enjoying the company of young kids. What did you expect? 10 year old kids are not going to have the capacity to formulate complex and unique trash-talk or retorts. You're playing a game with 10 year old kids. And yes, they have the freedom of speech, just as you have the freedom to not listen to it. If you want to participate in a more mature gaming community, you're going to have to find it somewhere else. Because xbox live is already populated by young kids and those who can tolerate young kids. And no, you arent so important that they should all clear out so you can have your fun in peace.
Honestly I would rather see kids grow up spewing profanity or other stupid cliche phrases than see them grow up silent and socially retarded. They'll grow out of it. I guarantee it. One day they will look back and laugh at how silly they were acting - one day they may be able to engage in intelligent banter with someone your age, Sessler. But right now they are just being kids. Whether it is "butt head" or n****r-f****t…kids will be kids, and they will say some silly things. Why be offended by it? They are just words. And coming from somebody who, as you clearly were able to pick out, does not know entirely what they are saying. I'm ashamed that you were offended, really.
It seems to me like you're the one who doesnt have tolerance or understanding, Sessler.
In any case. You just have a bad case of not enjoying the company of adolescents. They will grow out of it.
And placed at the end so you dont discredit me at the beginning: I'm 18 and have grown up around the online gaming community for 9 years of my life. I grew out of it. I've seen others grow out of it. I know how it works. From me to you: There is no problem here, its all in your head.
Honestly, I would have been more entertained hearing some of your "clever profanity". :/
June 12th, 2008 at 12:37 am
if some one says the "n word" on a game and everyone freaks out about it, that just gives them more reason to do it…you people are the ones who give these "biggots" power by reacting so excessively to these words….most of the time there not even "biggots" they are just kids trying to get a rise out of people.
June 12th, 2008 at 1:08 am
WHO CARES. nuff said!
June 12th, 2008 at 2:24 am
Cause its funny to hear people whine and go after you in game then get owned
.
June 12th, 2008 at 3:05 am
These are the same people who spend most of their time on WoW at level 70 ganking 1-20's and then calling people who don't play PvP wimps. It has become the "cool" and expected thing to be a complete asshole.
June 12th, 2008 at 8:13 am
@Spartacus: No, Griefers and spoilers in MMOs are going to a different level of Hell then the Xbox Live Idiots.. I think this all goes back to a certain level of anonymity among these forums. There is no personal consequences so many immature people (regardless of age) feel they can abandon whatever social pressure keeps them from doing that same thing in personal conversation (though in some cases I imagine its not that different to speak with them in person.. but I'm an old cynic).
I don't think its intolerance for youth alone, and I also think its unfair to classify the core abusers as "10-year old kids" when in fact I think I've had just as many bad experiences with older teens and adults who can;t seem to be courteous or respectful. Think about it this way, when we're kids playing sandlot baseball or soccer we always end a game with a "good game" because the coaches reinforced that behavior.
In the "virtual gamespace" there is merely competition without that mutual respect being reinforced and as far as I know there is no good mechanic to do that so we rely on people to act accordingly and continually get disappointed. So we have a few choices.. we turn off the voice chat.. or we only play with those we know. Both work for me.
June 12th, 2008 at 8:17 am
This racist crap is why gaming online on the Wii is so enjoyable for me….I don't have to worry about being the asshole that won't talk to anybody because Nintendo already made that choice for me…..no voice chat….thank you Nintendo.
Go Marlins!!!!
June 12th, 2008 at 9:04 am
He's absolutely right about the image issue. You think it's bad when the news reports about Mass Effect's sex scandal? Wait until they start taping some on-line game chatter.
As for "kids will be kids…", what a load of bull that is. That argument applies when a kid breaks someone's window playing baseball in the street. I hate to sound like an old fogey, but how about teaching the kids to be respectful of their elders and giving them a good spanking when they don't. Coddling these little brats is what is creating the situation in the first place.
June 12th, 2008 at 12:45 pm
They also like to say stuff about peoples moms. I just fake a cry say shes dead and say I'm going to kill myself and that I'm going to press charges. They (being 9-12) will freak out and be all apologetic. Hopefully then they won't be such idiots on Xbox Live anymore.
June 12th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
I am proud to say that I am not one of those people who talk trash just to talk trash. The only times I use my gift of spewing venom is when I'm provoked to do so by inane chatter and dumb 10 year olds. I rarely use any form of vulgarity in my trash talking online. Instead, I adopt to use whit and a demoralizing tone when I talk to people who are just talking complete nonsense.
I personally would love for Xbox Live as a whole to mature. But I am realistic and know that will never happen. When I get on an Xbox Live game, I know it's a crap shoot on how the room will behave. I'm always forced to play with a headset because I don't want that vulgarity spewing out of my home theater speakers for anyone passing by to hear.
June 12th, 2008 at 3:19 pm
Xaroth, you couldn't be more wrong in your response to Sessler's rant. While you may have the freedom to say what you want, you do not have the freedom to attack and belittle other people over a game. I hear the word "fag" used so often in Halo 3 nowadays its absolutely disgusting. While I may not be gay, I do understand that this is an incredibly derogatory insult for the gay community, and to use it in such a nonchalant way is inexcusable. These kids will get used to verbally abusing people who lose to them on Xbox Live and will then go on and use it in their daily lives. People don't understand the effects words can have on other people, and when these insults become commonplace it completely degrades society as a whole.
"Whether it is "butt head" or n****r-f****t…kids will be kids"
Are you fucking crazy? "Butt head" is okay, but nigger and faggot are words that are used to marginalize groups of people and should NEVER be used as insults. These are not words that parents should EVER allow their kids to use in any circumstance. If I ever heard my kid say nigger or faggot on Xbox Live their Xbox would be taken from them immedietely and indefinitely.
In the end, this is going to keep occuring predominantly on Xbox Live because of Xbox's affection to hardcore, competitive games. This kind of language is so common on the Xbox because of this fact, and while it does show up on both the PC and the PS3..these gaming platforms do not cater to the competitive gamers as much as Microsoft does. While I don't believe that it is Microsoft's fault that the kids are being so ignorant in their insults, I do believe that Microsoft has to increase the punishment (AKA IP bans) for these type of offenses. I also believe that much of the responsibility lies in the hands of the kids' parents…AKA don't like your child play a M rated game if he/she isn't 17+.
June 12th, 2008 at 3:33 pm
Did anyone else notice the dude holding the controller on the couch is holding a Playstation controller? Might have been nice if the folks who put the video together looked into that image a little. Heh.
June 12th, 2008 at 6:50 pm
Little kids tend to ruin xbox live. I play tf2 all the time and all I hear is I CAN HAZ CHEESEBURGER or people using the n word or calling people faggots. This usually leaves me to play with no headset or to just play on a team with friends only. I just wish there was just a button you can use to shock those kids in real life. Oh and british kids, please stop rapping over live… actually that goes to everyone.
June 12th, 2008 at 7:46 pm
@Xaroth (and anyone else who thinks that he may have a valid point): Why is it that every time someone calls these people out on their inappropriate behavior, someone starts spewing forth a bunch of freedom of speech garbage?
There is NO freedom of speech on the internet. None. Zero. Zilch. Sure, you can say whatever you want on XBox Live, but Microsoft can ban you for it. You can say whatever you want in online forums, but the moderators can edit your posts, delete your posts, or ban your account. Freedom of speech simply doesn't exist on the internet because you are always posting on someone's site, and since it's their sandbox, you have to play by their rules.
Even if you have your own site, if you are being offensive enough, your web host can shut you down. Freedom of speech is a glorious thing we have in America. Unfortunately it has no meaning on the internet or any online community.
If you can't see the problem, then I am sorry for you. This type of behavior only hurts the gaming community as a whole, as it perpetuates the belief that gamers are socially maladjusted, basement dwelling, mouth breathing morons whose only point in existing is to get one more frag. Honestly, most of us are beyond that. Perhaps if you examine your point of view and modify it, you can join us.
June 12th, 2008 at 9:49 pm
I can see I am in the midst of a "kids are worse these days than when we were kids" bitch-fest. Dont break a hip, you self-righteous, ignorant fogeys.
Perhaps the "ban on profanity" is not being enforced because it would cause a tremendous loss of Microsoft's Xbox-live profits.
While your idealist "stop them damn kids from swearing! buncha no-good potty-mouths…" viewpoint may look good on paper… I honestly find it a waste of energy to pursue. And I'm sure Microsoft would find it not only a waste, but quite destructive to their online gaming enterprise.
The internet is not driven by morals. "Profane behavior" is only strictly moderated in certain communities, with full knowledge that by exercising such censorship they are drastically changing the audience or member base they are going to attract.
And dont try to lump me in with "profanity-spouting 10 year olds", through implications however subtle. I am not standing on the other side of the battlefield to defend them, nor because I am one of them; I am over here because one thing I despise is people parading about on their self-righteous high horses - and because I like a good dispute.
In any case, you probably wont be getting any more respectful or effort-filled replies from me. I have other things to attend to. And in before anybody can fabricate any ridiculously unbased ideas as to what things I may indeed be attending to.
Racist language removed. See how that works? -Editor
June 12th, 2008 at 10:17 pm
We do it for the lulz, Adam. For the lulz.
June 12th, 2008 at 10:26 pm
You know what the real problem is? Softies who are still offended by this kind of thing in this day and age. Stop your crying, you sensitive bitches.
June 12th, 2008 at 10:58 pm
Xaroth, you need to understand that there is a large difference between profanity and racial slurs. I don't have a problem with someone saying "fuck off" or something on Xbox Live, but when people throw out "nigger" and "fag" and make it seem cooler for even younger kids to say, then you have a BIG problem.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:27 pm
The only problem (if it is even a problem) is being offended by such language, in my opinion. People who make such a big deal about it, those who are greatly offended (especially if they are not even of the race or sexual orientation in question), are those who make the language taboo. And if the language is taboo - it will be used by kids who are seeking attention, who want to shock people, or who are just looking to attach more meaning to what they say, whether they fully understand the meaning they are attaching or not.
Imagine being a little kid (10, 11, 12 years old?) - it shouldnt be too hard…
Almost anything you say to an adult (your parent, whoever) or even someone significantly older than yourself (5 years or more?), they have already heard before. You're incapable of bringing anything new that they havent already heard of, thought of, basically chewed up and spit out. You want to get a rise out of people, be interesting, be heard, have people pay attention to you (good or bad, although children often cannot distinguish between the two, and will bask in similar glory whether they are being frowned or smiled upon). Hey…you know some pretty strong words. Words that really got a rise out of people when you last heard them. You try them on for size. Success! Jaws drop. Whatever. You just got that attention you've been craving. Use the word again! And again!
Oh…and then they grow up and are actually capable of grabbing attention without spewing profanity or racism at every chance they get, and they realize that how they acted as children was pretty silly and immature.
But I digress. Children only use such words BECAUSE they are taboo. And you make them taboo by being (in my opinion, needlessly) offended by them. >.>
I hope the "BIG problem" everybody is so afraid of is not that todays youth are going to grow up to be extremely profane and racist individuals. Because they arent. If anything, racism and profanity as it is today, will die in a few generations as all you "fire stokers" who take such great offense to the language pass away (excuse me). Or maybe that is too much to hope for, because you all seem so persistent and intent on passing on the idea that "holy crap these words are BAD! BAD! BAD!!".
Disclaimer: I'm tired and did not proofread.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:32 pm
Some of us like to get together and make fun of and grief online gamers. The best way to get things rolling, to find out who the easiest targets are, is to offend them and see the type of reaction they have. How serious they take their online gaming or how easily offended someone is makes for a lot of fun if you have a group together in on it with you. It is a game within a game that is a lot more unpredictable because you can take it wherever you want to take it. We do this because it is an easy and somewhat entertaining waste of time. It comes at the expense of others, but oh well, we are enjoying ourselves.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:49 pm
You need to force the wmode for embedded Flash movies so your drop-down menus don't got behind the SWF, and your "Top Posts" / "Recent Posts" backgrounds should be GIFs with transparency near the rounded corners so that there isn't a hard, white edge when these items appear on a non-white background.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:52 pm
Fabulouth
June 12th, 2008 at 11:52 pm
It's a good soap box, but most of the newbs who do it don't listen. And there are a lot of black guys out there that would need to participate too. But they aren't going to, it's too prevalent in society. What are you going to do, get the kids to stop listening to rap, which has the N word and homosexual blasts, to stop listening to their music? It's just not gonna happen. I've just accepted the fact that while I'm online I'm going to be a N word to someone, and just gotten desensitized I guess. COD4 brought it back for me (Halo sux, it's not real enough). I miss the good old quake 2 ctf days on a 56k modem where you fought to maintain a 150ms ping, and everyone used chat. I agree though, I don't call anyone a N* and I don't wanna be called a N*, but society reaps what it sows.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:53 pm
It's funny that you're complaining about a 10 year old, when that's what you now appear to be. I haven't seen a grown man complain like that in a long time. It was really funny to watch and also quite depressing at the same time.
I'm not saying these kids don't need a spanking from mommy and daddy, but grow up. I like to grief people on games and it's funny to get a rise out of them, much in the way you reacted. Just play with voicechat off if you get all flustered because of it.
Keep on FOAMn, lil guy.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:53 pm
One other thing, GTA4 has the N word IN GAME. What are we gonna do, protest Rockstar? We can't, we like our games too much.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
ps: the reason people do it is probably because it's funny to watch you throw a sissy bitch fit
June 12th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
Stop playing then.
Panzees
June 12th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
xaroth: geez doode. way to not spell veries good.
disclaimer: I'm also tired and did not reread your comment so that I could itemize your mistakes and point them out so everyone can laugh at you. But I can't help admitted that 'trolling' is the in thing these days.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:58 pm
hey adam sessler you know this classic comic sums it up: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/
June 12th, 2008 at 11:58 pm
Ugh… People these days talking poopoo on the service. Microsoft doesn't give a rats ass what people say on there and they need to stand up and take actions.
I remember one time this guy what blasting off racist remarks, and I told him how it was and he left.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:59 pm
I can' stand hearing little kids cuss, sing, scream, make animal noises, eat loudly, yell at their parents/dog/friends, and just talk about stuff they don't understand. I can't wait for the day Glenn Beck or O Reilly catch onto this and a shit storm follows. Then and only then they may start enforcing the rating laws and I won't have to deal with 10 year old kids on mature games.
For me it's not about being offended, because I could care less about what some jackass kid is saying, it's about being annoyed.
June 12th, 2008 at 11:59 pm
Here is the deal: Someone simply needs to start a website that lists the those who are tagged as being the worst offenders, and offers up their screen names. Xbox should monitor that, and suspend those on the list.
*****BTW - If you want to get the racism to stop (in your room only), it's easy: I've been telling the idiots that there is a website where you can plug in their screen name and it will spit out their real name and address, then I tell them that I'm going to publish their real info. That shuts em up right quick.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:00 am
Xaroth, you're an idiot.
If you're uprooting the basic foundations of our society to say "there's no such thing as a word you shouldn't say" and then continuing on to say "poorly behaved kids are just acting by their own nature and should be allowed to act that way." That's just dumb.
You're dumb. Stop talking.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:08 am
if it's something you don't want to be a part of then get out. mature games, mature content…
June 13th, 2008 at 12:15 am
It's simple. They do it for the lulz.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:17 am
@xaroth
"youre a nigger fag."
how did that feel to you? you can insist that it doesn't affect you but im sure i just offended someone else. i grew up in a town that used "n****" since they first learned to get a rise out of people and guess what, they still use it. you generalize that just because you didnt use it, others wont either. hate to break to you that in other parts of the country, that isn't the case. everyones point is just to be tolerant of people's feelings.
@everyone else.
give me a break! insults are exactly what they are, insults. i can call someone retarded and im sure i just offended someone with autism. just because choice words are termed offensive, doesn't mean other insults aren't. i think that you parents may be a bunch of hypocrites if you can punish your kids for saying certain words but not for other profanity.
anyway, if you guys dont wanna hear people talking shit or dont want your kids saying a whole bunch of dirty shit, dont buy your kids damn videogames where obviously what they do is kill each other and brag. bad words are gonna be here to stay and dont act like you guys dont say it cuz im sure your kids pick it up from you.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:19 am
I gotta agree ..i hate it when little kids start swearing and they wont shut up ….its not completely what their sayin it their age and their nonwillingness to shut up for the sake of shuting up …truth im not really offened when a single race slur is used(prob cause im white male idk) but when its repeated over and over screamed in to the mic by a ten year old it pisses me off.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:20 am
I guarantee that 98% of all of the people you hear saying these profane things are not really racist or homophobic. People find it easier to call someone a f** because it is what they have heard growing up. It's a reflexive thing.
@Shaman: That would never work. You cannot base a (fair) system of punishment on hearsay.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:23 am
u c what i mean by the guy above me also prob a white male… i mean if he said it a couple of times watever..personally..but he took 1/2 of the whole scroll bar with that crap and now no one will scrool down to c the other comments..just like online when the kid is screamming Nigger i cant talk to other ppl or hear them
June 13th, 2008 at 12:33 am
All this rant does is split hairs. Racial and anti-gay words are just as part of some peoples vocab as sh*t and f*ck are for you. Your saying that those words offend you, but what about people who are offended by the cursing you do? Its all point of view. Go back 20 years it was the worst insult possible to utter any "normal" curse word of today. Those words are, in todays society, nothing more than an insult to most people. Its lost its racial or bigoted meaning for many, even most of the ones that are supposed to be insulted by them. If your gonna complain about being insulted then you shouldnt use language that can, in turn, insult or offend others. You cant want both, thats being arrogant.
However, if you really want to get rid of people saying those words then people need to stop being so offended all the time. The way these words became how they are is because people were offended. So, by complaining about this you will do nothing but refuel a fire in most people because offense is all they are looking for. Like you, I dont think that a string of cursing or racial slurs indicates wit or anything like that, but its not likely to stop. Not as long as theres still people who get so bent out of shape from what a 10 year old says in a pub Halo match.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:37 am
COD4 deffo has the right idea in regards to this problem with the mute feature…i get stuck on a team with someone that's annoying or offensive, BAM, i mute them & problem solved…..also i have no issues sending in a negative review or complaint on someone who goes over the line…true, while making someone lose 1/2 a star in their rating really isn't punishment (considering u can have one of your friends give u a positive review to make it go right back up) if everyone did this more often, Microsoft would probably be more inclined to suspend or cancel that persons account…we've already seen what they've done to Achievement cheaters & those with offensive gamertags, so u know they're watching
June 13th, 2008 at 12:41 am
I think everyone is missing the point here…
"And placed at the end so you dont discredit me at the beginning: I'm 18 and have grown up around the online gaming community for 9 years of my life."
I don't find the opinion of an 18 year old much better than a 12 year old. Something tells me this kid was in Diablo trade chat as a 12 year old spamming racial slurs like nobody's business. I think a lot of 18 year olds (99% still living with mommy) have a really big ego because they are labeled an adult and therefor have more life knowledge than anyone else.
So either you are a very ignorant 18 year old or a pretty decent troll. I'll give your trolling attempt a good C+, and if you really are that ignorant then please spare humanity and DO NOT reproduce.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:45 am
Adam,
I completely agree. It's a crock of sh*t to say that it's a reflective or a "conditioning" thing to use these kind of profanities. I've played a fair number of games on Xbox Live, and on other online communities, and I've NEVER heard the kind of racism, homophobia, and general hate-speech that I've heard on the Live network. It blew my mind. I've been called things that people would never say to my face, and frankly it's disgusting.
I think it is disgusting. I can't begin to explain why Live is so filled with this type of behaviour, but… like you, I've had to start muting my mic when I play, just to keep myself from freaking out at some 11 year old spouting the type of things that are heard daily by players like you and me.
That's not to say I never utter a simple FU*K! when sniped across a map in Halo 3, or HOLY SH!T when someone runs me down in GTA IV, but that's the extent of it….
It's nice to see someone with some media clout shedding some light on this. I doubt it will change anything, but… at least I'm not the only one bothered by this.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:47 am
First, can we go ahead and delete the long string of "N" words above?
Second, why is everyone picking on "little kids"? Most of my poor experiences come from other adults or late teens on Xbox Live. When a little kid starts cussing on XBL and they're on my team, I simply tell them that that is enough. It usually shuts them up immediately (though, I have a very, very deep voice, to that probably helps). My real problem comes from two other groups. Black guys on XBL and adults who thing it is funny just to say culturally insensitive things.
When I get on and play Halo 3, I hate being called "N". I'm a white guy. I know the history of the word. I know where it came from. I know why it was used. I know it's current acceptance. I don't care. It is not a pleasant word. And yet, I get called that all the time by black people (I say black because I am white, not European-American). I would think that of all people, they would be the most against using that word, but that is not the case. I get it thrown at me all the time.
The other worst offenders for me are late teens and early adults (or older adults, usually from the south–you know, the kind with just enough religion to make them hate minorities and homosexuals, but not enough to make them at least nice about it). I find myself playing against a lot of people who sound like typical guidos. It's ridiculous. They are super-pumped and ready to take on the world from their living room couch. And they can do it without messing up that fantastic hair. These are the guys that when you ask them to stop saying it decide to say it more. At least with black people, if they say it before the game starts and I ask them to not call me that, they are usually understanding and don't call me that. Guidos are the suck, though. They refuse to call me anything but that.
What's the core of the problem here? People are pricks. There's nothing more to it. Some guys are just jackasses and will always be jackasses. The only thing to do is for some of us who are responsible and respectful to step up and make sure that these people are removed. I actually record all my games anyways (I hate Halo's theatre), so if someone won't stop, those videos are sent to Microsoft. I know that a lot of people record their games, more people should turn in the videos.
And don't feel bad about getting someone banned. You're doing XBL a favor.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:48 am
I think the main reason people sound like that is very simple, that is how they sound and talk in the comfort of their own home. Thus, on XBOXLIVE, they are in their living room — feeling secure among those who can identify them, and not giving a rats ass about those who can't.
The word F– which I will censor, even though I'm using as an example is acceptable among many American families. Parents today grew up when gay bashing, (not the physical form) was very open and taught openly to be a negative thing. When their kids use the word, they simply feel proud and probably proclaim — just don't use it in public. The same can be applied to any other faction or classification of person, only probably now in smaller and smaller amounts.
The short answer is you just have to mute the bastards or play without them. You've already found the best solution unfortunately, private games.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:53 am
June 13th, 2008 at 12:53 am
Kojak, I think you win the award for dumbest comment on this replies thread. There isn't anything mature about what these kids/morons/bigots are saying. It's not mature content to have a 9 y/o call you a fag, its about as immature as you can get.
The first day I got xbox live I turned it on for some online Halo with several family members in the room only to be greeted by some kid who was younger than me spewing out racial slurs to anybody and everybody in the game. Try explaining that to your grandmother, or your younger siblings. It's not an issue of whoever is doing it to simply grow up. It's an issue of what the majority of gamers expect from our online experience, and what xbox live can ultimately do to enforce its policies.
June 13th, 2008 at 12:59 am
I love to see the little kiddies in here defending it. I remember being that age, thinking I had power because I had the ability to annoy adults. Yes, Anonymous, you've successfully gained the same power as an anal fissure.
You "lulz" kiddies will grow up, look back, and be deeply ashamed of what you were. It's part of growing up. You have some hard years ahead of you.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:04 am
Aargh, what are some of you not understanding about this? It's not about being offended, it's about the fact that it's *incredibly* annoying. I'd rather take a drill to my shoulder than have an hour of speaker-busting screaming from some 10 year old after I frag his ass a few times. I'd happily kick the shit out of one of these kids IRL, and I've always let them know that. It's probably good I'm not American, as the primary offensive ones all seem to sound like that kid off the video where he's yelling at his mother to go get him food and shut up and let him keep playing.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:06 am
I couldn't give less of a shit about people using the fag or nigger word, what I care about is the constant screeching of annoying 12 year old kids while I'm playing my video games. Fuck headsets. I don't want a conversation with random people on Xbox live, I just want skilled opponents to play against, that will shut the fuck up.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:09 am
Adam… god bless you…. i often have to mute my headset because of scum bags like that.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:10 am
I completely agree with the sentiment, but I'm afraid people as a whole are too small-minded to understand. I'm gonna reference George Carlin here in that words don't always represent their ugly origins, its all in delivery. Suppose I call someone a fag. That doesn't necessarily sleight the homosexual community, providing the delivery makes it clear that the word is being used to humorously emasculate someone. Has nothing to do with sexual preference, and I feel that homophobes have stolen that word from well-meaning folks. Having said that, yes, kiddos get too much of a thrill from anonymously spouting off foul words, and ruin the sarcastic humor the rest of the intelligent world uses said words with. My concern here lies in zero-tolerance policies regarding blue humor, as most large organizations/networks, such as Live, cannot monitor every usage of profanity to deem whether of not its situation-appropriate. To put it simply, only by keeping idiots out of the civilized world's affairs can we be assured of a perfect society. But of course that's not possible, and we must opt for the lesser of two evils, which, in this situation, is complete verbal liberty, understanding young folks will piss everyone off. Zero tolerance smacks of facism.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:14 am
Its simple, The world is full of Homophobic racist Neandrethals, always has been, always will be.
Thats why I don't play XBox Live, and will stick to a more mature and tolerant group of adults on PC games, then wannabe cool children(who miss the mark so far the arnt even on the cool world map) who's parents don't teach them respect, and use the XBox as a babysitter.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:23 am
Is a homophobe someone who is scared of homosexuals?
What does this have to do with calling someone a fag?
Is everyone that uses the n* word a racist? Then there are a lot of Black Rappers ready to join the Klan.
Frankly, I get the offensive part, but these kids are not necessarily racist nor homophobic. They are annoying little kids that talk on Xbox Live THE SAME WAY they talk when their parents aren't around.
I'm not defending them, I find it offensive and immature too. It's just that I don't think you can have an intelligent discussion on this topic without understanding why these kids say what they say. Sessler sounds like some outraged geezer who has no idea what he is talking about.
You know, short of having MS directly ban these kids when they mouth off (not through feedback, but through direct monitoring), nothing is going to change. Go to a private game channel with your friends. Problem solved.
And for you real racists who think it's only Americans, grow up.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:26 am
Sessler, thanks for this public insight into the dirty bowels of XBOX Live. I don't own an XBOX 360, but was recently playing an online game with a friend's kid's Live account, and the trash these small children are spewing is absolutely horrible. I haven't even heard some of this stuff come from the mouths of fully-grown adults, honestly, and I've been around plenty of raunchy folks! I don't mind hearing adults curse at each other and smack talk in general, but when you hear this filth from kid's mouths who can't be more than 12 years old, there is something wrong with society.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:28 am
Hey Adam –
Kids to this to get a rise out of people. Obviously it worked on you.
Be the adult - ignore them, turn them off. Getting pissy only gives them what they want.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:31 am
There are a few truths to all this …
1. Kids aren't being watched like they should … Parents like to BLAM the gaming industry for there kids acting up , or for there kids stealing and killing , but what they forget to look into is what there KIDS are doing .. What games these kids are playing . There is a thing called parent control , but parents don't use it , they don't site there and make sure there kids are play the right games ..
2. Young Adults ( Teens ) that site there and like to think there cool by talking there SH*T cause the other person has no idea where you live .. The fact is no we don't know where you live as well as you don't know where we live . Stop the BS , grow up a little and act more mature then your I.Q. the fact is your sitting at home playing a VIDEO game . Your not out there having fun with your girlfriend that you clam you have , or out hanging out with friends that you clam you SMOKE with or DRINK with .. Your Sitting at home talking SH*T that in real life you probable can't back up . That or your just someone that wants attention that your parents forgot to give you ..
3. Adults ( older guys that think there the SH*T ) there is a small group of guys out there that THINK there the SH*T . They guy that thinks cause he's playing with a kid that is half his age is going to look up to him cause he's acting a jerk to everyone else in that room .. Stop it !!! Really start acting your age , and show these younger guys what its like to me mature with others …
Now there is the fact that some people do play with there FRIEND , and sometimes you and your FRIENDS like to talk SH*T while your playing against each other .. We have all done it and have all had fun with in the games . But come on Online gaming is to meet new people , interact with them on a new level . Not to get into fights all the time …
Also as a side NOTE , people that like to make fun of other cause of RACE , or SEX or even cause they talk funny really need to stop it . Its not needed ….
As for the COMPANIES go , they need to have more age checking going on in both sections .. With in the company ( Sony and Microsoft ) need to start checking I.D or something like that for gamers to play online .. make it where the parents need to setup the console and not the kids .. make it where a Credit Card is needed or something that only the parents can do .. This would stop allot of this from the KIDS .. Also the gaming Stores really need to work on making sure that the Parents know that the game is an online game and is rated for a MATURE adult ..
Parents Get back into seeing what your kids are doing .. make sure there not playing something that PROMOTES violence or something like that ..
June 13th, 2008 at 1:33 am
Why do they? because it spread like wild fire…. I have been on xbox live and heard A Lot of clever people that actually told funny stories or jokes or whatever, but they were jokes and not blatant profanities yelled over everyone else that is just trying to talk. point is that the first guy was funny and then a bunch of moronic kids thought they were funny by blowing it up and not making any sense….. Mostly because they really don't know what they or saying or why they just think they are cool and it spread like crazy.
So how do you fix it….. I don't know, xbox is now banning people with the word gay in their name… thats probably a step backwards and will make kids think that it is okay….. I would vote that Xbox actually monitor complaints or listen in on random games. 3 or more complaints for language, racism, etc. you get a 1 week ban, 2nd offense 1 month or whatever, but i think temp bans could actually be rather effective.
It really is the same as being a keyboard warrior and internet flaming….. what is anyone going to do but bitch back? you say enough offensive things to someone and they WILL say them back. After every game i play i try to say good game or give them a compliment, but usually all i hear in the lobby is how big of a faggat i am and how i suck soo bad at the game…. but this applies greatly to age demographic and its is horribly sad and true that the younger they are the more offensive and annoying they are.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:45 am
You're absolutely right. It's a big problem but one that I think unfortunately won't or possibly can't be solved. The reason they do it is because everyone finds it so offensive. There's nothing worse than dropping the "N bomb" in a public match and (as you so eloquently put it) the "f**king neanderthals" get fuel from that. The way you play a video game has absolutely nothing to do with sexuality, race, or anything else to that extent. If I was to choose to be mocked for anything it would be skill. But no matter how you look at it, there negative comments aren't even valid since they don't know you and have never met you and would have no idea as to what you're really like in person. And the vast majority are kids seemingly younger than 15. Which brings me to a second point. If they're that age playing a game thats rated "M" what does that show not only about themselves but for their parents as well. I would've considered myself extremely lucky if my parents allowed me to play the sort of games I play today and would have enough respect for them and the common person to keep any negative comments to myself (if I had any.) The only thing that I think can be done and would actually make a difference, is generating a higher awareness to parents who allow their underage children to play such games that way their foul mouthed little kids won't ruin the gaming experience for everyone else. That's my two-cents.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:46 am
PC gaming definitely has an advantage over this, in that the servers are run by gamers who can ban assholes who spout racist or homophobic language. If they want to say that crap, they can set up their own server. I don't want to attend a KKK meeting, I just want to play game.
In the real world, there's no way I'd be able to play with anyone who acted like the anonymous jerks on Xbox Live. If I was playing a board game or a pickup game of basketball and someone started spewing that crap I'd stop playing with them. I probably wouldn't be playing with them in the first place, because the people who act like that are in pretty much every case the biggest dicks you'll ever meet. Just because you're playing online doesn't make it any different.
Thankfully, karma usually bites them in the ass as they get older. I wouldn't be surprised if most of the kids who act like that get shunned by society once they get out of school.
June 13th, 2008 at 1:49 am
Adam,
Grow a pair and quit fucking whining. People are what they are. Most people don't hop on Xbox Live with the intent of becoming happy, jolly, loving best friends with your sorry ass. They play to game and they play to compete. Hold hands with your grandma, not with the opposite team on Halo.
June 13th, 2008 at 2:04 am
Personally I think those of us who are older should take a lot of blame for the current state of behavior in the upcoming generations. Often times I think we forget that we are playing with younger and incredibly impressionable gamers who, like it or not, are ready and willing to soak up any and every mannerism that we portray.
The sad thing is that many younger gamers have prematurely entered an adult world by playing these online games, and the poor choices and bad habits that we have developed in life get transfered to them. Most young gamers aren't terribly aware of the implications of what they are saying, and if any thing they serve as a mirror to the attitudes and behaviors that we as an older generation of gamers exhibit.
But there's still hope, if we as responsible adults set the standards for what's reasonable and what's not for older gamers, what's cool and what's not for older gamers, we may still be able to salvage both the image of gaming culture and the attitudes of a younger generation.
Those with the ability to be responsible have the obligation to be.
June 13th, 2008 at 2:21 am
I call people "fags" and "niggers" on xbox live because I can't do that in real life. I'm not a homophobe or a racist (well, not a bigot), but I know those words are really effective; They are great words to use. Some people will understand that it's just a game, that it's just to have fun and screw around. Some people get offended. If they raise that up to me (that they're offended), I just tell them they're fags and mute them.
Yeah, those niggers are no big deal.
June 13th, 2008 at 2:45 am
I thought by now the idea of being offended in games would have subsided by now. I forget what game may have had the option to vote first but democracy is the way to do so. I believe that we can solve this issue very simply with out this great outcry and better represent the gaming community and eventually power. I do give people who generally put up such filth on xbox live terrible ratings and will turn people in for abuse like such. I honestly feel it is something that needs to be done and encourage everybody to take the initiative and report it.
Though in general i find great community on games that tend to have a high game turnaround like rainbow six and ghost recon. The community in the games tend to just not put up with the issues that are mentioned above. Halo i gave up entirely after about 3-5 weeks of playing online consistently for reasons other than poor gameplay…
Honestly without in game random moderation and everyone actually using the the complaint system for what it was intended. Non-intrusive and proactive action by the publishers and micro$oft can only reach so far. The community actually has to do something about it. Degradation of online performance could help on serious offences. Though as i stated the community in game have to have the power to clean up the game as it happens. Bunjie helped this with the almost so easy mute system but when I'm taking down LefWingnut1 amidst a firefight we could use some democracy to vote for something other than the next map change … . .. .. . … or the respawn screen to easily shuffle and ban some players from games. The solution is there the companies just need to know where to help us cut down the wastoids who hamper the image and enjoyability of our games. I don't have a problem in rainbow with the younger players they get a little out of hand sometimes but don't last long when they do. I just hope someone out there can think this through and help combat the issue. Could you imagine if people who were voted out of x% of their games they played could only play with those people similar to them… teams can vote people off their team…it cuts down the admin part that pc games definitely have a grip on…much cleaner than waiting for a match to end and complain to the host. You dont like em on your team grab your teammates and vote him off. Afterwards a requirement to cite why with voice… there'd be a good use for it
June 13th, 2008 at 2:48 am
BradOFarrell, you're an idiot.
I think you need to review your elementary notes on sentence structure before you try to insult someone again. You don't even express a complete idea or though then proceed to call Xaroth dumb. You, sir, are dumb.
To get back to the topic at hand, Franz & Xaroth have the right idea. It will take a few more years (probably more) for everyone else to board the desensitizing train, but it will happen just like it did for all the other "vulgarities" that are now common in almost every facet of life.
On a side note: I'm glad Anonymous is showing their presence here. I laugh at the people who don't understand what Anonymous represents. It warms the cockles of my hearts to see confused adults label them as "immature kiddies" simply because they are unable to comprehend what Anonymous is. Sincerely, I thank the Legion.
June 13th, 2008 at 2:51 am
I obviously agree.
Mainly my problem is in Halo 3.. You can jump into ANY Halo 3 match and find a bunch of kids yelling at each other, usually it starts with a bunch of 12 years old's saying something offensive and a mature person telling him to shut up. In reality face to face that kid would shut the hell up, but being only is completely annonymous and Microsoft does absolutely nothing to police it.
The only way this could be fixed is to get Microsoft to agree to form some sort of player based police or something, people that are over a certain age perhaps, that have an extremely good record and go through a bit of microsoft screening get the privledge to kick people from matches or hand out infractions or some sort of 20 minute banning or something.
Other wise, these are just american kids growing up in a new world where you can look up sex in the dictionary online and be able to find porn in 1 click of their mouse button.
Kids of this generation are completly ignorant shits, specially online.. they think they are unstoppable, someone honestly needs to punch them in the face everytime they say something racist or offensive.. But because we are online, we cant do crap and we just look like tools yelling back at them online.
Ill stick with playing private games with my friends, yah.. it's a shame.. but what are you going to do.
June 13th, 2008 at 2:52 am
You children posting with the names BIG BALLS talking crap about Adam are just proving his point.
Grow the hell up.
June 13th, 2008 at 3:21 am
To Xaroth: wow this is easy. Do you know what your biggest problem is? It's the same one all of us "fogies" had to go thru… your 18 and your mind thinks that it "knows it all". Your mind isn't even capable of understanding how much it fails to know. You think you have stumbled upon some great "duh" truth… and you can't understand why the people from the past are throwing up danger signs.
It's not your fault… you just don't have much experience in life (as you your self alluded to when you said you were 18).
Oh and to who ever said trolling was in fashion now… dude where have you been? Trolling was in fashion before there was an internet.
June 13th, 2008 at 3:37 am
I used to do it, but I stopped as I matured and entered my mid teens
a) because I came to understand what what I was saying truly meant and how it truly did hurt people
b) because I was one of the more avid gamers around (being ranked in the top 10 worldwide for 2 different online shooters) I heard this talk a lot and I seemed to think it was appropriate… well, not appropriate, but acceptable.
c) I was an immature little kid who wanted attention from the adults on the server so I'd say shocking things to get them to yell at me and not get in trouble, it was kind of like bucking your sense of authority.
Little kids are a bane on all online games and everyone hates them, unfortunately, there's little you can do to stop them unless you create a little kids gaming section and an adult gaming section.
June 13th, 2008 at 3:42 am
Which ones? Console or pc
June 13th, 2008 at 4:15 am
Is Kojak serious? "Mature game, mature content"? How does a game like Halo, where you save humanity from destruction, call for being called faggot or nigger? How the shit does that even come close to matching the content of the game? Tell me, ignorant fool. It's a problem, and you're BLIND. Not everybody enjoys conjectures about their sexuality or race from complete strangers, like you do.
June 13th, 2008 at 4:19 am
Set privacy to only hear your friends, only solution now.
June 13th, 2008 at 4:44 am
I play a few source games like css/tf2 here in Australia - we hardly ever have mic spammers - some times you might get a 12yo who talks a bit much but never nasty. Tho i might guess there aren't any here because our admins are quick to ban ppl that are racist. Dose xbox live have utility's to ban ppl? why don't the admins do something? or are admins also bigots?(!)
June 13th, 2008 at 5:07 am
This comments thread alone is enough evidence for America to carpet bomb itself.
Let's get biblical.
June 13th, 2008 at 5:08 am
also…
Xbox360 is aim at kids. kids. pc is much more teens/adult.
xbox360 is easier then pc to boot and play which = more young/dumb ppl.
xbox360 is cheaper the pc which = poor ppl (poor ppl are less educated - i know i can't afford uni)
xbox360 is microsoft - ms aren't well.. er.. how can i put it? they don't care and they don't think ahead - there work is generally quite poor and buggy
Almost all parents have no idea what there kid(s) are doing online.
MSG to parents: "the internet is just like NYC - there are toys store, parks, schools AND prostitutes, murders and rapist - and there all with few block of each other - just behind a click of the mouse your 12 is surfing porn and getting picked up a by a pedophile in online chat.
would you like your 12yo child walk around NYC at 3am? no? so why let them online with out supervision?
parents just don't get it. FUCKIN' SHITS ME.
oh and btw ppl who act like asshole get the chicks - something i still don't get.
June 13th, 2008 at 5:16 am
I have grown tired of playing online because of these types of idiots. At the end of a match, when they want to talk trash, I would rather say something back that makes them completely shut up because they have to think about how badly I've insulted them without using profanity.
As for in-game, I give them one chance to shut up, then I mute them and be done with it. Most of the time, when this happens, my other team mates do the same thing and the idiot gets left out in the cold with all of us talking about them… Of course, occasionally this turns into everyone helping the idiot die faster.
Needs to stop, parents need to watch their children. The xBox, Playstation Wii, etc are not babysitters.
June 13th, 2008 at 5:18 am
There is no evidence that Neanderthals were anything but versions of us with no chins bigger noses and bigger brains so i doubt calling someone a neanderthal for being a bigot is a harsh enough statement.
I dunno i certainly do swear a lot online but it's only rarely that i direct that vulgarness at other people and if I do yell at another person it's mostly calling someone a effen ahole or something for laying waste to me over and over again.
With me it's almost like a tourette's reaction to getting killed, normally I manage to flick the mute button before i let the expletives fly but every now and then I'm sure an outburst gets threw. Although I rarely if ever play games that get me pissed off like that anymore. Something about being pissed off when you are a youth that is intoxicating but when you get older it's just exhausting.
But I also think it's different on the consoles because normally you only have like 8-12 people in a match and 4-6 on a team so if someone is being a bully they can get away with it. on the PC online I find if someone starts pulling that bullshit when you are on a team of 12-16+ people have a lot easier of a time putting an end to that sort of rubbish.
it's odd, i think the reason people use the bigotry swears is actually because our societies are getting to be much more tolerant. Saying something racist or homophobic is simply taboo now. It's something our society does not accept so unfortunately that's what people reach for.
As much as i love gaming and don't think violence in video games has much of a effect on kids, I do think putting kids in that harsh competitive anonymous environment gets them really ramped up
June 13th, 2008 at 7:04 am
@Jonathan
Seriously can we get a "report abuse to moderator" button put in or something? These damn kids are getting out of control….seriously.
Go Marlins!!!!
June 13th, 2008 at 7:30 am
With Microsoft banning names like "The Gayer Gaymer" and "Richard Gaywood" (do a google search for more info on those stories), what do you expect from the community?
As a gay man, I hate this kind of crap but there's ZERO enforcement from Microsoft to stop it. In fact, Microsoft is ENCOURAGING it.
June 13th, 2008 at 7:40 am
That is one of the reasons why I do not play Halo and other online games. Unless I have the ability to mute individual players or kick/ban them during or after the game, I avoid it or go to servers that actively kick/ban loud-mouthed smacktards.
June 13th, 2008 at 7:46 am
I'm a 22 year old student and I spout the most disgusting filth on live quite regularly. I'm not racist or homophobic (though I'm sure many of you will tell me I am) but I enjoy using the most taboo phrases to get a rise out of people.
When I play league games people use the mics for tactics and so do I. When it comes to playing randomly though the mic is only really useful for chatting or abuse. Since I'm rarely playing with friends, the abuse option gives me a brilliant interactive aspect of gaming that I've never used before. I can shout abuse which is great fun and see what reactions I get. All you people who get annoyed, thanks
June 13th, 2008 at 7:54 am
I agree. The racism is rediculous. Not on Xbox (cause I don't have one) but on other servers like Counter Strike Source. Anyone who says crap like that, I write them off as a dip$hit moron. That's all I can do.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:05 am
I think half of the problem is the bulk of the people irked by horses**t behaviour like that are over 18. I play CoD4 with a few people who are younger that won't put up with it either but they're in the minority.
MS got us to sign up, howabout age verification? I'd love an 18+ Xbox Live experience.
Then again, they've got truckloads of money. Three key terms n*****, f** and f***** all sound very distinct. Monitor voice comms and flag people for review if they've got too many hits. Call centers monitor agents for quality.
(Then again, I'd feel sorry for the kids who have a clanmate named 'Rigger') 
June 13th, 2008 at 8:14 am
It's to be expected really. When I first started gaming the only way you could actually communicate with other gamers (outside of the room) was by buying an expensive computer, setting up and paying for an ISP and going though some reasonably complicated (compared to XBL, anyway) set-up just to get into a game. That was enough to keep out the children.
These days it's so easy to hop into an on-line game even the most retarded people on the planet have managed it and, understandably, the first thing they're going to do is demonstrate just how retarded they are.
Microsoft can do one of two things in my opinion. Firstly they could actually begin monitoring the number of infractions for each account and have some kind of "three strikes and you're out" rule (though each strike may be made up for several infractions). Certainly begin sending out notices that continued abusive behaviour may lead to the account being closed or voice privileges being revoked.
The other possibility is that they make it so complicated to actually get into a game all the stupid kids will be unable to figure it out.
I prefer the latter.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:16 am
While it is beyond old hearing these little kids shout profanities through my TV set and headset, the reality of the issue is beyond that of gaming and parenting. I tend to believe that it isn't solely a bunch of Mid-West white kids home alone, because I've heard some intensely offensive comments made from other nationalities towards Americans as well. All too often I've heard a British accent scream, "I hope your father was in the tower and got burned alive," or "I'm glad Osama blew you up, I hope he does it again."
The true issue to be discussed here is a person's inability to be respectful and honorable. The young kids screaming these profanities, and adults too, are the ones losing at their endeavor; so they shout the first thing that comes to mind and it's the one word we hear hundreds of times a day in American culture, "N****R!" It is the responsibility of the adults involved to immediately end that type of conversation through muting, blocking, reporting or if you're a parent, a good old fashioned as$ kicking.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:17 am
It's simple. The kid is lonely and wants attention. Kids are very powerless and they act out often as a result. This is why most stories that appeal to kids show a kid that is "smarter" than adults (i.e. Harry Potter) doing things on his or her own. Kids are very parent-dependant and resent this.
By the way, that G4 commercial that was on just after you I found pretty offensive. Some tiny guy says, "Give me the best boobjob I can buy." and then some other guy drills into his chest.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:21 am
GTA IV has a great multiplayer feature that I think all games should adopt. If the majority of the room votes to boot you from the game, you're removed from the game immediately. Problems become solved easily when you allow the community to self moderate. Take WikiPedia for example: they are a Web 2.0 social interaction site that is community moderated and is now an official credible source of facts and information. You can cite Wikipedia.org on your college term paper!
June 13th, 2008 at 8:26 am
I completely agree with Xaroth on this. In about another generation people aren't even going to care about what other people say to get a rise out of them, and after that people won't even try to get a rise. All in all that seems like a better world to me. Imagine if there had been an Xbox Live before the Crusades (ridiculous, but bear with me here). If people could have gotten all of their intolerance out in a manner that doesn't ACTUALLY hurt anyone else would there be nearly so many problems today with religion?
People who are truly offended by racial, ethnic, and homophobic terms are in a boat that isn't fun at all to be sure. But, why are you offended so much by some ignorant moron behind an online avatar? What have they truly done to you? How have they hurt you? And before anyone can say anything about me not being offended because I'm part of the perfect little white majority world (eventhough we are NOT a majority of the world, not even close) I'll admit that I am, and that the racial, ethnic, and homophobic slurs don't affect me because they simply don't apply, but that does not mean that other things did not affect me. I'm a fatass or at least I was. I'm now nearly the same weight that I was before when I was made fun of all the time. There really was almost nothing I could do about it, so you know what I did? I GOT OVER IT. I MOVED ON. People always want someone to pick on for any reason they can find. We all do it. I guarantee that EVERYONE in this board has belittled and picked on someone for some reason. My main point is this I guess:
"Don't care about what other people call you or say about you, their opinion doesn't matter at all. Your self-image should be good enough that nothing should affect you."
Sometimes this makes people seem like there is nothing that's important or sacred to them anymore, not true. People like this, like myself, have just come to the realization that small little things like profanity or slurs at others aren't important at all. If you want to get riled up about something get mad at people that PHYSICALLY abuse others, or steal from others, or politicians, or scientists, or people who are religious zealots…. I don't care, but for the sake of intelligence give it a rest on this ignorant bigotted shit.
P.S.-
Some of the most deeply philosophical discussions of my life have taken place during games of Halo, Call of Duty, Battlefield, or any number of other games simple because I directed it towards that goal. It's amazing how these "dumb 10 year-olds" respond when presented with something that they don't understand at all, but want to understand… They shut up and listen. Don't yell at them, don't tell them to grow up… they're kids, they'll grow up when they're damn good and ready to and no sooner. Give them something else to talk about, be the parent yourself if you're going to bitch about it so much. And to anyone else that's tired of this crap on Xbox Live or anywhere else… You can do one of three things to resolve your problem:
1. Take the easy way out and keep bitching about it. This will most likely do nothing to stop the problem, but go right ahead. If the past shows anything, passing along the problem to someone else always solves it.
2. You can get over it and move on. Realize that if this does offend you that you can move above it and should move above it. If you don't care then why bother?
3. DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Take action yourself and try to get people talking about other things. You'll be surprised at the average intelligence of people in most online gaming communities, they aren't as dumb as they first appear. Get them to change with you and the problem is solved completely.
AND LET THE TEARING OF MY CORPSE BEGIN……
June 13th, 2008 at 8:28 am
I think Xbox Live should include Kicking in most of there games. That way if someone is talking smak just boot them
June 13th, 2008 at 8:37 am
BLA BLA BLA….who the hell cares. Racism has been around for hundreds of years and it's just being exposed in modern times, using today's technology. I could care less if people are spitting off racist remarks and just let them be. Its their life and to each their own. If you dont like it, sell your xbox and get a wii, you pansy.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:38 am
there is a real big difference between saying the N-word and calling someone a faggot. Homophobia is a freaking joke in and of it's self, Gay people make the choice to be gay.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:38 am
I didn't read very many of the comments left, but I'm guessing very few people actually stepped up and admitted they do this. I'm admitting now that I am a culprit.
First and foremost, I don't find swearing to be that offensive unless it's meant to be offensive. I don't think the word fuck or shit are bad words at all, it's the way they've been labeled, so I use those frequently in conversation.
I do throw out the frequent homosexual reference of 'faggot', but I don't mean that to demean homosexuals because I'm not a homophobe. I say it becuase it's a word that has, as I've grown up, become more commonplace and has taken place of words like 'idiot' or 'dumbshit'. I've also explained this to people who have questioned me online.
As for the racism, I do that too. I would like to state that there's a difference between African Americans and 'niggers'. A nigger is an ignorant person whose opinions don't matter to me at all. The very definition of the word in a dictionary is 'a person who is ignorant; inferior', anyone can fill this quota - a white person, an Indian, a Chinese person, Middle Eastern. A member of any of those races can easily be a nigger because they could act stupid.
African Americans are just another race like white people, like Indians, like Chinese, and like Mexicans. They do they're part to help society and unfortunately can't move past what has happened in the past. I mean, I completely agree that slavery was a terrible thing and that civil rights are needed, but in order for racism to attempt to come to a close you have to let go of that word as being so offensive. Yes there are racists, but some African Americans are just as racist against white people for no reason as some white people are to them. Case in point - I can't walk in certain neighborhoods because I'm white and said neighborhood is majority African American. Even driving down it is scary. One time I stopped at a stop sign where there was a group of African Americans and they just stared at me. Had it not been the middle of the day I garuntee they would have tried something shifty because the neighborhood is known for the violence.
I know someone on the other line of that microphone is a nigger if, as soon as I get into a game, they try to start shit with me because of my screenname/alias/gamertag whatever you want to call it. Yes, it does sound a little scetchy, but it's not. The name at the top of this comment is the name I use everywhere and have since I was about 12 or 13 years old (am now 19). It's a combination of Mr. (Mister - mista) and the first three letters of my last name WAC. So essentially it's a slang way of formally presenting myself, as much of an oxymoron that is.
So, as confusing as that whole explanation may be, that's my reasoning. I don't say 'fag' or 'faggot' to be offensive to homosexuals, I say it because today it's commonplace to say it. And I don't say nigger to offend good, hard-working, honest African Americans. I say it because it's a legitimate name to call a complete dumbass.
As for Hedgecore's comment about 18+, I would absolutely LOVE 18+ online gaming. Playing with 10 and 12 year old kids that get online and try to act tough pisses me off to no end. They scream the dumbest, most ignorant shit into the microphone. They also have no reason to be playing online with adults. I shouldn't have to watch my mouth when I'm playing with three or four friends and some 12 year old from Jersey joins the game.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:40 am
I'm glad I got a PS3 this week the online community is much MUCH more mature! The system actually works when requested. Now I know it's not Microsoft's fault for making online unbearable on Xbox live. Unfortunately it's at the point where going on Xbox Live is like walking into Wal-Mart or going into a theater at 3 in the afternoon, with every kid/soccer mom in existence. It's not the place/service is bad it's the community that's bad, and there is no way to fix it either.
I feel that online gaming in the future may be less than it is now, with the behavior on Live, the higher prices to pay every month. It might be easier/fun to play an offline single player game than an online match with a few 9 year old racists.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:42 am
I totally agree with Sesslers. People need to grow up. I don't play that many games, I don't own an xbox simply on the principle that I hate Microsoft. I yell enough obscenities at XP, I'm not even going to get started with Vista. My obscenities just aren't homophobic or racist.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:49 am
As a gay guy who has been gaming since the Atari 2600, I would like to thank Sessler for at least discussing this problem. I used to play WoW and I would constantly roll my eyes at some "You fag" or "That's so f*ing gay". It was ignorable at first, but after awhile…it really starts to get under your skin. I mean, I don't feel the need to flaunt my sexuality in game but apparently you "breeders" are so insecure in yours that you feel the need to try and insult us (just like for some of you I just did now) to try and fulfill some "machismo" need or something.
Perfect example is Ted Haggard (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Haggard). Me thinks he doth protest too much.
But I agree, there is a level of anonymity online that people feel like they can get away with anything. I am a very athletic, 185lbs, muscular guy (this is not a personal ad
and if they were looking straight at me…they might call me "faggot"…
Once.
But parents, get involved and be aware of what your kids are doing. And adults who fall in this category…grow up. There is one thing that these verbally abusive people and gay guys have in common…they both suck.
June 13th, 2008 at 8:54 am
And this is why I dont own an xbox
June 13th, 2008 at 9:18 am
XBOX Live does have a feedback system, which I will use if the person becomes disruptive to the point where I'm annoyed and everyone around me is annoyed. And if it's to the point where I actually want to leave the game, I'll just send a report to Microsoft. The tools are there, we just have to use them.
– I've never actually reported anyone to MS, but I wouldn't rule it out if someone was being a raving asshole.
June 13th, 2008 at 9:20 am
I have found the best thing to do it call them on it. I had a kid going off on a rant and I essentially shouted him down, called him on his racist crap. Reminded him that some of the best and nicest guys I play with on Live are of the minority he was ranting against, and Marines, and serving our country. He was a kid with only about half a mind and shut up, some of the other kids chimed in and supported me and razzed the racist kid. He bounced himself out before the round ended.
If we let it go on around us, aren't we just about as bad? Clean up the group you're playing with by calling these ignorant idiots on their language and lack of maturity. They may all end up in a room together spouting their crap, but at least I don't have to listen to it.
I am surprised at the age of some of the kids I run into in games that frankly aren't appropriate for kids that age. Where are the parents? I am a parent and there is no way my kid was playing anything like COD until he was about 16. Is this a fertile ground for growing a new racist generation? Are these kids influenced by the diatribes they hear? Of course they are. Just like every other part of life, parents need to monitor and guide their kids. I am a 47 year old male that has been playing video games with my kids for many years. All you dads out there, play the games with your kids! Even a local coop game will give you a sense of your kids temper, especially when you encounter a #@*@$# jump puzzle. It will ive a sense of the influence it's having on your kids live, bring you closer to understanding them, plus it's a lot of fun. Just expect to get spanked a lot at first, it does get better but ht kids are always just a hair faster.
June 13th, 2008 at 9:28 am
It pretty much boils down to maturity and respect.
I mean when I was twelve, we cursed at every given opportunity and everything that was 'undesirable' was 'gay'. Of course as you get older, you either recognize the fact that the words you choose are just as significant as the actions you choose, and they reflect equally in regards to how you present yourself to the world and how others perceive you…..or you never grow up and you maintain the mentality of a foul mouthed child.
If course now, I'm significantly closer to 30, and I still curse like a sailor on amphetamines when playing Gears or Vegas 2…but the racism and homophobia has got to go.
On a side note, I've noticed this behavior predominantly more in 'pick up and play', Halo styled action games online. I've actually had a blast playing titles that require any moderate amount of strategy or thought in order to stay alive, as opposed to 'running and gunning'. I suppose the aforementioned 'children' prefer not to access any higher level thinking skills…
June 13th, 2008 at 9:46 am
wow, give them more attention please.
Who is the fool? The fool, or the fool who blogs about him?
June 13th, 2008 at 9:47 am
Simple fix. Remove the anonymity that XBOX gives these kids. Make them accountable for their actions and this will end.
When they know there's a chance you could roll up to their basement and shove your foot up their ass,they might think twice.
June 13th, 2008 at 9:58 am
Why play on XBox Live when Microsoft bans gamertags which contain the word "gay"? http://consumerist.com/5008908/gay-player-name-banned-by-xbox-live
Yes, the same Microsoft which caved to an evangelical minister and backed down from supporting a non-discrimination law in Washington state a few years ago, now bans the word "gay" from a gamertag. Meanwhile, the Human Rights Campaign still gives Microsoft a perfect 100 rating in supporting gay rights. That's bullshit.
So is it any wonder that the haters would flock to XBox Live when the company that runs it hates gay people anyway? Gay people should not support Microsoft when they are so two-faced.
Everyone should stop buying Microsoft products and services because Microsoft peddles crapware.
June 13th, 2008 at 10:13 am
Likely for the same reasons that every seventh grader give an adamant speech on Adolf Hitler
June 13th, 2008 at 10:15 am
listen.
everyone is being entirely hyper sensitive.
I'm asian. and when someone makes an asian joke. its hilarious. i can laugh with them. and even when they try to be hurtful, why would i let that get to me? they don't fuckin know me. I have my family and friends..i go to college. everything is great. why would i let some punk ON A GAME, bring my day down?
i can guarantee you I'm smarter than they are.
but more importantly, the problem is all you people who are complaining. because thats reverse racism and reverse discrimination.
if you hear "nigger" online why do you immediately feel bad for black people?
if that black person had a problem with it..thats his problem not yours. he can defend himself. why do you feel the need to defend him? because you think he is incapable of defending himself?
i know me and my buddies get drunk and say some nasty stuff…but that doesn't mean im racist, or homophobic! i have friends of almost every background.
hell, i call my black friends nigger. they throw a "chink" right back. its no big deal.
all im sayin is dont let someone on xbox live hurt your feelings. because you will be called worse things in life, from people who actually matter…and its gonna hurt way worse.
and also i think you guys are missing the point of his soapbox.
what he was saying is that this type of language and behavior is unnecessary. why cant we just play a match, and say..
"o nice game, you kicked ass man.." or something like that..
ps there is a feature to turn off the speaking.
June 13th, 2008 at 10:19 am
To those who argue that Wii's online is better for lack of chat feature is not actually doing anything to remedy the situation. Hiding away and removing a feature that has potential to enhance gaming is not the solution. Instead you must keep this function and find some method of control within it. Taking a step back and hiding in our caves because our feelings might get hurt is not the way to go.
I agree that this is partly the parent's fault. They should learn what their kids are doing, saying and playing. If they allow this behaviour to persist (and God forbid, encourage it) then they shouldn't have the right to procreate.
Those who say "grow up" and "accept it this is the way the world is" : you're basically a quitter. You see the problem and allow it to persist. Hey, remember when people back then in WW2 holocaust saw a problem and allowed it to persist
- sure its a grave example but you see the point. Avoiding the problem only worsens it perhaps to the point where it can become that bad.
Live already has offered solutions- avoiding gamers, muting them etc but again it doesn't stop the person from acting the way they do; it only stops them from acting the way they do towards you. There is a rep system which should be used more often.
A possible solution would be to have some sort of voice/word recognition (which I know is a very difficult thing to do) and when certain words are heard from a gamertag repeatedly then the person is kicked out of a game. Repeated offenses lead to greater punishments- day/week/month/year/permanent bans.
A funnier solution would be for Microsoft to send a letter to the offender's address after the person commits many offenses.
Finally to those actually defending the behaviour, badmouthing Adam, saying its for "lulz/lol/the funny". You are even worse than those who act that way online because you are not only allowing it but encouraging it. You are the problem with humanity, not just gamers.
June 13th, 2008 at 10:19 am
Right on, Sessler!
I agree with Robert - the homophobia starts at the top with Microsoft banning "gay"-sounding gamertags. It's absolutely absurd and disheartening…
June 13th, 2008 at 10:23 am
Hearing people regularly toss around uninspired racist or gay slurs when you're trying to play a game and have fun mitigates that whole "fun" element. It gets mind-numbing and after a while I just sort of check out. If it was a case of being offended, at least that would be engaging… it's a case of being bored to death.
June 13th, 2008 at 10:27 am
@mark.
comparing bad words to WW2…
wow.
fail.
June 13th, 2008 at 10:32 am
Personally, I hate that shit. I'm not black but I am bisexual and to hear someone using "faggot" 50 times in a match really gets to me. It doesn't really hurt my feelings or anything but it does make me extremely sad for the future of humanity. Eventually these people that speak like this anonymously will start to use such profanity and bigotry in their daily life.
It has nothing to do with first ammendment rights or my "intolerence" for children. You don't hear that type of thing IRL in the sense that you do online. It's disgusting.
From now on, im just going to start reporting people. If enough of us start reporting people for using that type of talk then maybe microsoft will do something about it.
June 13th, 2008 at 10:36 am
and in response to Robert and his comment about microsoft banning that one guys tag becuase it sounded homosexual…
IMO they were trying to combat this exact type of situation. If you get on a match and your gamertag is "gay" something, all you are going to hear is "hey faggot" all day long. I support the tag ban.
June 13th, 2008 at 10:39 am
Your yelling at the wrong people, Halo 3 is for casual gamers which is why they can't keep thier cool when they die. I don't think I've ever seen someone freak out and yell insulting stuff all the time on a PC game, apart from the odd kid on lame CSS or something but again that kid will just be an angry unloved child which only plays it ev